Torqueflite 727 Guapo

If you're starting out from empty (tc & fluid pan drained) it will take roughly 9 qts give or take 1. May as well buy a 12 quart case. That way you have a few extreez on hand. Some people like to dump a few qts into the tc before installing it. I've never bothered with that step and I've never had a problem getting the level right. When I'm at the point where its time to add fluid and I know the thing is completely empty to begin with, I'll dump 7 qts down the fill tube, fire up the engine and let it warm up with the shifter in neutral. Always remember with a stock 727, the converter will not fill up with fluid while the shifter is in park. That's by design and that's why it says right on the dipstick and in the service manual to only check the fluid level while hot idling in neutral. With 7 qts in, I'm probably not going to see any fluid on the stick yet. Whether I do or don't its fine either way because I'm still adding. Dump another qt in, slowly cycle the shifter through each gear position and then back to neutral. Shove in the dipstick and take another peek. Now I'm probably seeing some fluid on the stick, but I'm probably not in the safe range yet. Once you have fluid registering a little ways up the dipstick, start thinking in terms of pints not quarts. Getting these units overfull is just as bad as not enough. You want the goldielocks approach. If I'm not in the safe range yet, I'm probably looking at 2 pints or 1 qt still to get it there. If I'm flirting with the bottom line, I probably will just dump half a bottle in which is 1 pt and check it again. Once I'm well within the safe range, its time to go for a short test ride and grab some gears. If all goes well, when I come back, I'll check the level one more time in neutral and figure out how many more pts, if at all I need to get that level up pretty close to the top Mark. I like to achieve and maintain a fluid level that is just a sliver below the top line. Anywhere within the safe range is...well, safe to operate, but I figure why flirt with running it too low? Give yourself some cushion.
 
Ok... Tc is out and back in... I run a level across the front of bell housing and go crazy from chicken hollerin in my ears... I have about an 1/8 of an inch from nub on tc to level down side... She seems good...
 
I hope you're having luck getting the tc to come out. I came across suggestions similar to the one I gave you for trying to get it to fall out. The more I think about this, the more I'm thinking you didn't have the tc fully seated this time either. I can judge pretty well when one is in when I can physically see it and feel it, but trying to make that judgement call over the nets or by phone isn't so easy. I consulted the service manual for more guidance and came across a method for making dead certain that the tc is fully seated. It involves a straight edge and a measuring device. When the tc is fully seated, there will be a half inch gap between the straight edge and any of the contact pads where the flexplate bolts thread into. I'm sorry I didn't stumble on that tidbit until now. Like I told you on the phone last time we spoke, I'm still learning new things all the time. Hopefully no damage has been done and you will be able to make a clean attempt at this once more.
 
Ok... Update time. After spending all night on this subject of tc stuck in trans I come up with a lot of info... Seems to happen most in cry, jeeps and fords. Lots of ways people have got theirs out. From bolting the tc to a branch in the neighbors tree and dropping it until it came out... Or the guy who cut his out with a grinder... Interesting stuff.

I used two posts, some chain and a come-a-long... It popped right out. The front spline looks fine. Back spline has a few small barbs. Tc looks perfect.

So now some file on the barbs and see from there. Now just need to know how to make sure it's aligned right this time???

Ps... Thanks 4 all the help trevor...
 
Glad your were able to get it out with no horrible damage done. File the barbs down and you should be good to go as long as the tabs on the pump drive gear are still where they're supposed to be. As for definitive, its all there in my previous post. Flat edge across the case opening...measure a half inch clearance between it and any one of the flexplate bolt pads. If you get that measurement, you're golden. Anything less than a half inch means danger danger will robinson! Attach a c-clamp or vice grips up against the face of the tc once you get it fully seated to keep it from sliding forward until you get the case up in place.
 
I can get it in there... Oops, just realized cap lock was on... Ok, I can look through the seal and see the two tabs. I can get the tc on there, run a level across it too measure the pads and I have about 5/16 gap. I'm going to replace the front seal so maybe I'll get a better looksie when doing that... Any way to tell if tabs are good?

Still pounding my head against the wall :mad2:
 
If you see the tabs, then they're fine. If you'd busted one or both off, you wouldn't be able to see them until they fell out on the ground as little chunks. 5/16ths ain't a half inch, but its closer than 1/8th. The next time you install the converter, set the trans case up in a secure manner with the opening facing up. That way you'll have gravity on your side. Consider wearing gloves 'cause when that heavy ass tc with gravity behind it drops home, it will smash the shit out of your fingertips if they're underneath it. Ask me how I know that one! You're doing alright. You didn't want to nail this the first time out of the gate, did ya? What fun would that be? Come on, enjoy it a little! Tee hee hee hee.
 
Trev... Pulled the seal out and got a good looksie in there... There are two tabs one at 12 one at 6... They both have space behind them and turn free... I have the transfer case attached so standing it up will be a challenge (but not impossible) and I've massed my fingers enough on this. I'm guessing the tabs slide in the slots in the tc???
 
brandossii said:
trev... Pulled the seal out and got a good looksie in there... There are two tabs one at 12 one at 6... They both have space behind them and turn free... I have the transfer case attached so standing it up will be a challenge (but not impossible) and I've massed my fingers enough on this. I'm guessing the tabs slide in the slots in the tc???
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Daggum...yer a glutton fer punishment. Were it me, I'd be separating that t-case yesterday and install it after I have the trans in place. Makes the whole shit-er-ee a fuckton easier to balance. I suppose by now you have a system worked out for that unwieldy sumbitch...but I say again...daggum! A starved pygmy can bench press a d20 into place with one arm tied behind his back. To each his own though. You do what works best for you.

brandossii said:
hey what happens if I take the 7 bolts that are on the pump housing cover???
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You have seven loose bolts in your hand.:icon_lol: other than that, not much. That pump body is press-fit and sealed into place with a square-cut, perimeter o-ring. It takes a slap-hammer threaded into the two special threaded holes (one on either side) to bitch-slap that mo-fo outta there.
 
Glad I asked before I was stuck with 7 bolts rattle'n in my grubby paw :icon_scream: and when I go to put it back in I'll snap some fotos of my pole,come-a-long,floor jack,sling set-up (patent pending) :mad2:

well off to lectric work as auto part closed early today... Nice wasted trip 8 miles into town for "gone fishin" sign... So have to wait till morrow for seal.

Tomorrow gets to be nother crap, crap, crapaty, crap day... Yeah!!!
 
Man this popcorn is good. As I'm sitting here on my skinny ass laughing. All this talk of trans work makes me wanna start pulling my 72 trans out and rebuild it. But, one project at a time.

Although, one question does keep popping up in my own mind when I do some tinkering with the 727.

Is it worth while to even consider doing an overdrive modification to these ole IH 727's?

Apparently there is some kind of kit and/or has been done in the dodge/chrysler 727's in the past. Either that or fork up the cubic major funds for a 700r4 swap
 
Kimball, if having auto w/od in your Scout is that important, I believe your best bet would be to go the 700r4 route. The admittedly little that I know of the "supposed" 727 od modification leads me to conclude that it would be akin to opening a dump truck load of mushrooms in your front room.
 
Ok... Jumping ahead a bit... The metal bracket that bolts to the trans and sits on the cross member. Where it sits on the cross member metal to metal or does it sit on some kind of rubber piece? I ask as mine doesn't have anything on top but did have rubber underneath...
 
There should be a sandwich of rubber or poly in that location. It is not at all uncommon to find the cushioning part of that piece has deteriorated severely after all these years. Without proper cushioning, you will have excessive drive train vibration. IHPA has replacement bushings available from the online store.
 
scooter said:
man this popcorn is good. As I'm sitting here on my skinny ass laughing. All this talk of trans work makes me wanna start pulling my 72 trans out and rebuild it. But, one project at a time.

Although, one question does keep popping up in my own mind when I do some tinkering with the 727.

Is it worth while to even consider doing an overdrive modification to these ole IH 727's?

Apparently there is some kind of kit and/or has been done in the dodge/chrysler 727's in the past. Either that or fork up the cubic major funds for a 700r4 swap
Click to expand...

scoutboy74 said:
kimball, if having auto w/od in your Scout is that important, I believe your best bet would be to go the 700r4 route. The admittedly little that I know of the "supposed" 727 od modification leads me to conclude that it would be akin to opening a dump truck load of mushrooms in your front room.
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Just to put a more fact-based cap on this notion of modifying or converting the tf 727 to overdrive...there are mopar kits available from gear vendors for this purpose, but they have no provision for the reverse texas adapter housing and married 4x4 t-case found in the sii 4x4. Their 4x4 kits are only for divorced units. So that pretty much bursts the bubble for an sii 4x4, unless your plans include hanging a divorced t-case also. Would you like a steaming can of worms to go along with your sauteed mushrooms?:icon_down:

now, in the case of a full-size 4x2 pick-all or a 4x2 sii, you could in theory tear down your trans, and if you had the necessary parts on hand, convert the entire output assy over to a mopar back half. That would then allow you to purchase and install a gv overdrive kit. Obviously, prop-shaft modification would be necessary due to the added length created by the gv unit.

As for a 4x4 pick-all, some creativity with regards to the intermediate shaft would likely be necessary, not to mention possible cross-member mods. Mushrooms! Get your your steaming hot, sauteed mushrooms! Get 'em while they're hot! And we haven't even talked $$$ yet. You think the 700r4 conversion is spendy? The gv kits run anywhere from $2800 to 3 large before shipping. Don't forget to add in the cost of all the other necessary items.

When you take everything into account, the 700r4 conversion is cheap by comparison, even in the case of a sii 4x4, which requires adapters on both ends.
 
Up date time... Went to local "crapa" auto store to get the seal and they give me something that is a 1 inch id... So not even close. So 18 miles to the o... Get right seal, put it in... Had a cold beer, smoked a cigg... Then put tc in... Oh and trev... Smash finger comes with it. I have a 1/2 inch and easy way is nub is below los... So now another beer, then jack and crack and put it in... (and jack and crack = floor jack and lots of but crack work)
 
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