Cam and Engine Build Choices

Well we are getting there, slowly but surely doing a few things a day.

Have some questions about intake manifold installation? Looks like all the bolt holes are open at the other end. What's the preferred sealer for these intake bolts? Anything on the intake gaskets? Little sealer around water jackets? I'd like to only do this once! :ihih:
 
Virtually all component installation points are covered in many other threads in this sub-forum.
 
I found this by typing "intake gasket seal." took about 30 seconds as I drank my coffee.
Searching the forum can be difficult because one needs to nail exact key words to have success. Its not google. You'll have to take a few swings at it sometimes. But mayben is right. Its all been covered, you just have to dig for it. He's likely sick of answering the same things week in week out.

http://www.forums.IHPartsAmerica.co...permatex-copper-spray-head-gasket-sealer.html
 
Yes that would be helpful if I were asking about the gasket. But I was asking a preferred sealer for intake bolts. Simple question and I'm sure I can find it through search some day when I have time. Thanks for the help.
 
Mark,
I assume you are going to copper coat the steel shim gaskets both sides and the manifold/head surfaces. Lek it tack off and bolt together.
The bolts if not blind will require a sealant like the GM stuff you have built. Use the same stuff as you would have on those. I use the arp white paste in the tube. Good thing is that it is retorquable.
 
Robert kenney said:
Mark,
I assume you are going to copper coat the steel shim gaskets both sides and the manifold/head surfaces. Lek it tack off and bolt together.
The bolts if not blind will require a sealant like the GM stuff you have built. Use the same stuff as you would have on those. I use the arp white paste in the tube. Good thing is that it is retorquable.
Click to expand...
yes I have always used copper spray on the metal type gaskets and have found that is recomended here easily. But could not find a difinitive answer on the bolt threads. If I remember looking at them, they are all wide open at the bottom. Did not detail if they all are intake or water but knew everyone needed sealer of some sort.

I think I have enough of the white thread sealer I used on the oil galley plugs. But it was permatex brand. Some of the threaded bolt holes are close to exhaust crossover too. So heat May be an issue with intake manifold bolts. It would be nice to get proper sealers in all leaky holes the first time! :idea:

exhaust manifolds I always use anti sieze.

Gaskets that came with kit were cork and I think part rubber but we bought rubber oil pan and valve cover gaskets. I know everyone preaches no rtv!!! But I use a very thin sparing layer on both sides of what I know is true, straight and clean and have never had an issue. And never had a leak! But using it instead of gasket or way to much on any motor can cause oiling issues.
 
Take this for what its worth. All I can say is I have done it on several engines in the last 10 years and have never had an issue:

3m super 77 for rubber pan gaskets and valve cover gaskets. Its a product normally used for bonding foam rubber (padding on the inside of a shipping case for example), not necessarily this application. Hang the gaskets as if you were painting them, and spray both sides. Let them dry 15 min or so. Place on engine, then place pan or valve cover and finger tighten the bolts. Half hour later tighten the bolts up and you'll be good.

Its a little outside the window of normal operation, that's why I am hesitant to publicly endorse it. But I have a strong track record doing it this way and I know it works. In my experience, rtv does not stick to rubber so well. Maybe better on cork. But I won't use cork, so that's why I tried this initially. Best of luck!
 
dealbreaker74 said:
3m super 77 for rubber pan gaskets and valve cover gaskets. Its a product normally used for bonding foam rubber (padding on the inside of a shipping case for example), not necessarily this application. Hang the gaskets as if you were painting them, and spray both sides. Let them dry 15 min or so. Place on engine, then place pan or valve cover and finger tighten the bolts. Half hour later tighten the bolts up and you'll be good.
Click to expand...
I think the key to using a silicone type gasket sealer is the way it is applied and then let dry then tighten. Just as you described with the 3m super 77. :idea:

I am stuck on permatex black. The way I use it? It never fails! Just like your doing. But when higher heat starts to come into play some products that usually work great? Fail! Hth!
 
eagle-Mark said:
I think the key to using a silicone type gasket sealer is the way it is applied and then let dry then tighten. Just as you described with the 3m super 77. :idea:

I am stuck on permatex black. The way I use it? It never fails! Just like your doing. But when higher heat starts to come into play some products that usually work great? Fail! Hth!
Click to expand...

Its best to stick with what you know. Just throwing my two cents in. My method has served me well for 10 years of heat cycles on many different engines. No leaks. I'd be hesitant to do it differently if someone suggested it. So again, I can respect sticking with what got you here.

I've also had fine luck with the white permatex thread seal on the mani bolts. Oil can migrate out of the valley and up through the bolts if you install them dry. But that's only a problem when the pcv system isn't up to snuff.
 
Well, it's a runner! :ihih:

I'll have to get some pictures up of the engine done and in the truck. But we've been driving it around a couple days and can't even find a drip of oil or water! :ihih:

power with that cam is unbelivable change in IH engine attitude! :ihih:

I didn't get the fuel injection system done for it so we started it on pertronix and the good running carb that came off it. No spark, double check wiring, test with dvm and ? Not working? So I pull the cap of and see smoke!!! :yikes: buurned a hole on outside through a sticker? What did I do wrong?

A few notes on what I do when building a motor. Besides assembly lube on all internal moving parts I prime the oiling sytem with a drill, you can make a shaft from old distributor or buy them, I got one with my engine parts from IH only.

Lifters: I have read a lot of things on lifters, I don't know what's right but I soak then in break in oil 24 hours, then I slide them into a small round tall glass. Cover the lifter with break in oil. Push down on lifter and hold down. After 5 to 15 seconds air bubbles will come out. Sometimes you have to do it twice but about 40 bubbles and you can no longer depress lifter. If you get 30 bubbles you can still push down on lifter. Let it up for a minute, then depress and hold down, if you don't get anymore after 5-15 seconds well your done.

I install the lifter with cam break in lube and try not to let the motor turn over more then ten times in build and start up. Fill the carb bowl. Prime the fuel line to clean fuel in tank. Fill with water only because if you have a leak you just keep adding water for 20 minutes till cam is broke in!

Lifters installed, motr oil pump rebuilt with assembly lube, attach oil pressure gauge, spin pump slowly, my makita on slow about half trigger is all it needs to flush the motor with over 40 pounds. Now while you maintain a slow 40 pounds turn motor over and watch for a drop in oil pressure. Soon as you see a small drop in pressure you can look down your oil fill and see the oil coming up in rockers. I am not sure if when the cam lines up the hole to let oil up top happens once or once for each bank. I could not see in the other cover but when turning over I did notice one more drop. When you see this drop go a little bit more and let the oil flow.

Anyway even with turning motor over a couple times while priming and even having the pertronix never make one spark I am still within my goal of no more then ten turn overs. Reason for this is you don't want to wash the break in lube off the cam. You just want to spead it smoothly. The reason for 2000 rpm is because it takes more rpm then idle to sling oil to thoroughly lubracate cam and lifter surface. Then you keep ypur cam and lifter soaked with oil while the break in, heat up to operating temp if you have a 180 thermastat then once it hits 180 you still got about ten minutes at 2000. Rpm. Poof your cam is broke in! I have never had a cam fail.

Just some numbers. Oil pressure during prime could hit 60 psibut drill would start to smoke.
40 psi was a crawl.
Motor cold running 60
motor hot idle 25-30
motor on freeway hot 45

so anyway reinstall points and gap (when it startes I had 26 degrees dwell by eye) checked the timing and set to 15. Had it running at 2000 rpm within about five revelutions of stsrter. Checked dwell, checked timing, started looking for leaks. I have endless amounts of water but use none. I have 2 extra gallons of oil but use none. Motor smoked oil for about 2 minutes then was off choke and running clean. Can't find any failures so when the radiator started pumping water out we put the cap on. Started looking for water leaks, found none. Watching the gauges was easy we had them sitting on windsheild cowl pointing at us. 180 degrees for ever and always over 40 psi. Checked the time and shut er down! Only thing I had worried about and thought this would be my first non perfect cam breakin, I couldn't figure a way to fix it or keep it going if it failed. The brand new flamethrower coil that came with the pertronix I left in with points and after about 5 minutes run time I saw it drip! :yikes: well it was dripping more and more as time went by but it made it full 18 minutes. 8 minutes to 180 degrees, saw flow in radiator, started to push water out as it got hot and put cap on, then 10 minutes hot run time. :ihih:

back to lifters! I have heard a lot of stories of lifter clatter when IH engines are started. Ours barely tapped for 10 seconds probaly less. So I think a properly bleed lifter and a properly primed oil system cures this issue.

Hope that helps anyone who reads this thread and picked up a few tips from me, as I have hed a lot of inside pros help me get my first IH engine rebuild perfect first shot! Thanks guys! :dita:
 
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