62 Crew Cab 4x4 restoration project

[overdrivesteve]

steve,do you have all the emblem's / badges for your truck ? Don't have door lock's ? Jeff

Hi,
not sure if I have all the emblems or not, but don't think so. It appears there should be two on the side of the hood, one above the gas tank filler on the passenger front fender, and something on the front doors. The front passenger door also has a gold emblem on it that says "custom" but don't see any evidence where a similar emblem goes on the drivers door.
Steve

 

[overdrivesteve]

steve,do you have all the emblem's / badges for your truck ? Don't have door lock's ? Jeff

Hi,
I definitely do not have any of the emblems or badges that go on the truck, other than the big one on the front of the hood, so I am looking for them all.
I'm also looking for any gas tank filler tube pieces I May be missing. See this thread to know what I'm referring to:
http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/basic-tech-questions/9971-am-I-missing-something.html

Today I finally began working on the truck. First task was to get the door locks replaced and working. I had no key to one lock, and the other lock with a key was broken and every time the key was removed, the cylinder would come out with it.

There is a clip that holds the lock cylinder in place in the door - very easy to tap into place or remove (from inside the door). But, as only a po can do it, rather than tapping the clip down over the cylinder, the po tapped the clip directly over the lock cylinder, and somehow snapped it into place in a direction where it could not be tapped out as it was tight against the door edge, but could only be tapped in the direction of the inside door edge to remove the lock. If you don't know what I mean, that is ok as I am just ranting about the po's stupidity again. Here is the clip, the large one on the right, I am talking about:
door lock cylinder clip for Scout II - International Scout parts

I had to break the clip to get the lock out to take to a locksmith to rekey.

That was another adventure, as most locksmiths here can no longer work on these locks. Finally the 4th automotive locksmith I took the locks to was able to rekey the locks. He also had a box of old lock clips - I bought 2 (it's good to have an extra just in case...) for a dollar each.

Next on my agenda was to begin repairing all the leaks in the gas tank and filler assembly. The po strikes again - he used a radiator hose as a gas filler tube, sliced and flared out at the top to attach at the filler plate, and had no provisions to do anything with the vent tube now just dangling next to the filler radiator filler hose tube.

You can see pictures here:
http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/basic-tech-questions/9971-am-I-missing-something.html

It's late, I'm tired, and I need to go to work tomorrow, so good night for now. I hope you enjoy the story of the drama of this build...

Steve

 

[overdrivesteve]

Hi,
just a little update on the door locks I repaired yesterday.

I actually took 4 locks to the locksmith. Between them, he was only able to get 2 to work properly. And they are now keyed alike.

The latch assembly was previously shot with wd-40 and worked very well. But in installing the first lock, it was very difficult to get it to work smoothly. Felt like I was going to break the key every time I turned it. In the end, it turns out that because the lock part of the latch had not been used for countless years, I had to work it with a screw driver and pb blaster and wd-40 until I could get it to work smoothly. Then re-installed the lock assembly and it works ok now.

I then went to work on the drivers door lock - I thought the problem was the same, shot it with pb blaster then wd-40, but actually the problem was different. Sometimes it would work and sometimes no matter how hard I turned the key, it would not unlock. I suppose that's why the po removed that lock assembly long ago. It turns out that, for some unknown reason, the window channel interferes with the latch piece moved by the door lock cylinder. Simply bending the window felt channel a little at that point fixed that problem. The lock on this door now smoothly locks and unlocks.

I also found the smaller lock cylinder clips on these doors were much easier to remove and install than the larger "stock" clips, both shown here:
door lock cylinder clip for Scout II - International Scout parts

Just passing along a couple lessons I learned in replacing the locks on these doors.

Steve

 

[FDChappie]

Shoot some silicone or teflon spray on those locks. The products you used are good for freeing things up, but are not good lubricants.

 

[overdrivesteve]

shoot some silicone or teflon spray on those locks. The products you used are good for freeing things up, but are not good lubricants.

Hi,

in the past I used to just squish some wheel bearing grease onto the door latch and window regulator mechanisms inside the door as it was water-resistant and seemed to stay there forever. But I'm sure lubricant technology has improved since then.

What "brand" of spray-on lubricant would you consider to be the very best for this application? And for window regulators too?

Thanks.

Steve

 

[FDChappie]

In the door lock tumblers I like tri flow on the latches and window regulators I use a white lithium spray grease.

 

[overdrivesteve]

in the door lock tumblers I like tri flow on the latches and window regulators I use a white lithium spray grease.

Thank you chappie for the reply and info.

Seems like I get so little free time to work on this project. One of the next problems I've decided to work on are the massive fuel leaks this truck has from both the fuel filler and top of the gas tank - gas seems to pour out of both places. The fuel gauge also always shows empty.

I somewhat addressed the fuel filler problem in the thread: http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/basic-tech-questions/9971-am-I-missing-something.html

I've decided to first go with the stock filler hose, although very pricey. Then, depending on how it works, I May go with a custom filler tube if I find a problem. Eventually I'm sure I will go with a custom fill tube when I install an over-sized fuel tank system, but that is later. So I am still considering the suggestions people have posted there and and sent by pm - all very much appreciated.

But before I start stirring things up by pulling the gas tank, I decided to install the fuel filters I have had sitting here.

This first is a high-capacity 2 micron filter I put between the fuel tank and fuel pump. I chose the wix base part number 24770 because it can be installed with the inlet and outlet on either side. (I put them both on the same side, as you can see). Although I used a wix fuel filter p/n 33528, eventually when I change that filter, I will use a baldwin bf7633. This 2 micron filter is in contrast to the little inline 140 micron fuel filters normally used. When I started the engine, the stock/leaking fuel pump was able to fill and suck the gas through that big filter and the engine never had a miss.

I still have the fuel pump itself to rebuild/replace as it has always leaked from the day I got the truck. And the carb twice started leaking badly, but with a tap on the side, it stopped. Hopefully it was just dirt, and the new filters will keep that from happening again.

I also hung a little fuel/water separator fuel filter on the carburetor. It also lets me see the general condition of the gas. It uses a 10 micron filter, wix p/n 33034 although I'm sure I'll change that to a baldwin, p/n pf857. For the record, my fuel pump has a glass bowl attached, and it uses the wix 33943 or baldwin pf859 filter.

I did a lot of research on filters and wrote up my findings in detail on the second page of this thread:

http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/ba...2-there-different-grades-wix-oil-filters.html

I could have wrote another 3 or 4 pages, mostly on beta ratios and other specs to support my conclusions, but decided it was already approaching information overload for most people.

Today I also finally installed the proper battery hold-downs. Previously the battery was held by a bungee that seemed as old as the truck, very cracked and deteriorated and about to break. With no shop, and so little time, for now I have to be satisfied with these little accomplishments ;-)

most likely the next installment of this build will be the removal and repair of the gas tank. Any advice anyone can offer would be appreciated.

Anyway, here's pics of my two little gasoline filters I installed. Kind of extreme, but that is supposed to be the theme of this build for ultimate reliability. Careful measurements were made so as not to interfere with the heater box assembly on either side of the firewall, after its repair and installation.

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[FDChappie]

I like that air cleaner with the duck bill to drain any water drawn into the intake. Is it stock???

 

[overdrivesteve]

I like that air cleaner with the duck bill to drain any water drawn into the intake. Is it stock???

Hi,
yes it's stock - for some IH engines but not this one. This was a nos housing for a turbo diesel IH engine, but I no longer remember which model or year. The housing still has the part number sticker on it, but the lid is no longer available from IH. Is its purpose to drain water? It appears it would take a little pressure to open that rubber duck bill up; with water and/or vacuum it appears to be sealed, but I could be wrong. I thought it might be a form of backup pressure release if the turbo over-pressurized the intake - but I'm just guessing.

I would really like to find a proper lid for it. It uses a 14 inch lid. The one on there now is from an old dodge car from a pick-a-part yard. The problem is it's 1/4 inch off in height. With a 5 in high filter, I need to use a 1/4 in rubber gasket under the filter element to seal properly, and with a 5.5 in high filter element, it sticks up 1/4 inch. They don't make a 5.25 in high filter element for truck applications. I'm looking for a mostly flat lid. There are some 14 in lids used on some trucks that are 2 inches high, but 7 inches total, although they make filters that high, is too high to fit under the hood of my truck.

Everyone, the next time you're at the local wrecking yards, or checking your pile of old parts, please check to see if you have any 14 in air cleaner lids. Pick-a-part here doesn't usually have larger old trucks, and most other wrecking yards here, for liability reasons, won't let you walk around "looking". You need to tell them the year and model of truck and they will let you know if they have parts for it.

Thanks for your help.

Steve

 

[MarkO]

It looks like you will be filtering your fuel extremely well.

I would have put the sediment bowl first inline to screen out all of the big chunks. I am about ready to install one myself due to all of the chunks that keep blocking up my driver's side fuel tank line.

I would also be concerned about getting the sediment bowl too warm where you have it mounted. 'binders are not prone to vapor locking but the new ethanol blended fuels change the boiling point downwards making vapor lock a real concern.

 

[overdrivesteve]

it looks like you will be filtering your fuel extremely well.

I would have put the sediment bowl first inline to screen out all of the big chunks. I am about ready to install one myself due to all of the chunks that keep blocking up my driver's side fuel tank line.

I would also be concerned about getting the sediment bowl too warm where you have it mounted. 'binders are not prone to vapor locking but the new ethanol blended fuels change the boiling point downwards making vapor lock a real concern.

Hi marko,

I think that big spin-on fuel filter has so much "dirt" holding capacity that it can hold all the big chunks and tiny 2 micron size bits that could possibly be in my gas tank. As for vapor lock, we will see, but I will definitely post it here in this thread if that happens. But won't really know until I take it out in the desert camping next year.

But tonight when looking to get some comparison prices for a new sending unit for my gas tank, I came across this picture (attached below) of the fuel tank recommended as stock for my truck.

It looks so obvious how the filler and fuel line should connect to this tank. Or is that the filler and vent, and the fuel line pickup is attached with the sending unit? But it looks kind of low to be a vent line as I would think the vent should exit from the top of the tank. But then where is the vent hookup? Or fuel line output? I just don't know as I have no experience with IH trucks. Can others please tell me, is this what your fender-fill, side frame mounted gas tank looks like??? And where are your vent and fuel line connections?

Mine doesn't look anything like this at all. Now I wonder if the p.o. Put some other gas tank in its place. My fuel line is a hard line that comes from some hidden side of the gas tank, comes down and around under the tank, then looks cut near the bottom of the rubber filler hose tube. And clamped to it is the rubber fuel line going to the fuel filter.

And the filler hose goes to a metal pipe that also goes to an unseen side of the tank. And this metal pipe is very lose so I suspect it is attached with another rubber coupling to the tank's actual input.

If mine isn't the proper tank, but this one in the attached picture is the proper tank that should be in my truck, I've got some more serious decisions to make real soon. Do I try and fix my tank with oem parts, or do I get a replacement oem tank like shown below (very pricey) and outfit it with oem parts, or do I design a custom tank, then outfit it with oem parts so the gas gauge reads correctly, stock fuel filler fills correctly, etc. Pros: it will have a much greater capacity, and will have no corrosion issues; cons: very much more time consuming, and will be just as expensive as a new stock replacement tank.

I once had a 57 Chevy panel 4x4 I designed a 60 gallon gas tank for that I was very happy with. If I get no more response to my questions about this gas tank as I did to my power steering questions here,
http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/basic-tech-questions/9999-general-power-steering-info-wanted.html
I'll just have to design my own gas tank as I have no idea about the proper way a stock gas tank should look or hook up.

Steve

p.s. Is this safe, or is there some safety factor/device/engineering I'm not aware of? I always thought gasoline tanks should be on the inside of the frame because if another vehicle ever runs into the side of your truck, you'll go up in the biggest ball of flames this side of 9-11. And I don't want to live the remainder of my life in the burn ward of a hospital. I've never had a truck with the gas tank on the outside of the frame. ...so little I know about IH trucks.

 

[Scoutboy74]

The stock location of the fuel tanks of the '69-75 d-series pickups was on the outside of the frame in a side saddle configuration, and I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that the earlier models featured a similar design. That's certainly better than having a tank in the cab behind the seat as many domestic trucks sported even up into the early '70's, but logic dictates that an inside the frame location would be preferable, as seen on most light trucks produced post-1980. Its hard to pinch a tank between the body and the frame in a t-bone collision if the tank is mounted inside the frame. That said, if you remember back in the late 80's/early 90's when stone phillips was attempting his major expose of the '73-80 GM "rolling firebomb" pickups with side-saddle tanks, his "objective" news program actually rigged the subject trucks to ensure that they would burst into flames in a dramatic, hollywood-style display. It was a major hoax. There were literally millions of those trucks produced, a reasonable percentage of which are still on the highway. How many actual "rolling firebomb" incidents have you heard of involving that vintage of GM trucks?

 

[MarkO]

The one real advantage of going to one large tank between the frame rails behind the rear axle like suburbans is you can get a tank that is much larger than the combined amount you can get in the standard and optional tanks.

Of course, filling up one 40 or 60 gallon tank takes a whole lot more $$$ than filling one ihc tank at a time.

On my driver's side tank I have some real issues with crud and corruption. So much so the stock pick up won't pick up any longer.

I solved the problem by plumbing in a feed out the bottom through the drain hole.

Yes I get a lot of stuff but it is fairly easy to get to in order to clean the line out.

 

[chico]

Great looking truck my friend. Just started following it today. Curious though, do you have a manual for this truck? Have you thought about buying one? I bought one for my Scout II and it was like somebody turned on the light switch. This forum has a lot of great info but I would highly recommened a manual. I know the feeling with doing a driveway budget builder. The limitations suck! Hang in there with all the po finds. I have had my Scout for 2 years and still find stuff all fuged up. Look forward to more posts and hope you get that thing more on a "drivability" state. Even if its to the local liqour store for a 6 pack. Get that truck out there so it can be appreciated. Keep up the good work man. Kcco!

 

[jeff campbell]

hi marko,

I think that big spin-on fuel filter has so much "dirt" holding capacity that it can hold all the big chunks and tiny 2 micron size bits that could possibly be in my gas tank. As for vapor lock, we will see, but I will definitely post it here in this thread if that happens. But won't really know until I take it out in the desert camping next year.

But tonight when looking to get some comparison prices for a new sending unit for my gas tank, I came across this picture (attached below) of the fuel tank recommended as stock for my truck.

It looks so obvious how the filler and fuel line should connect to this tank. Or is that the filler and vent, and the fuel line pickup is attached with the sending unit? But it looks kind of low to be a vent line as I would think the vent should exit from the top of the tank. But then where is the vent hookup? Or fuel line output? I just don't know as I have no experience with IH trucks. Can others please tell me, is this what your fender-fill, side frame mounted gas tank looks like??? And where are your vent and fuel line connections?

Mine doesn't look anything like this at all. Now I wonder if the p.o. Put some other gas tank in its place. My fuel line is a hard line that comes from some hidden side of the gas tank, comes down and around under the tank, then looks cut near the bottom of the rubber filler hose tube. And clamped to it is the rubber fuel line going to the fuel filter.

And the filler hose goes to a metal pipe that also goes to an unseen side of the tank. And this metal pipe is very lose so I suspect it is attached with another rubber coupling to the tank's actual input.

If mine isn't the proper tank, but this one in the attached picture is the proper tank that should be in my truck, I've got some more serious decisions to make real soon. Do I try and fix my tank with oem parts, or do I get a replacement oem tank like shown below (very pricey) and outfit it with oem parts, or do I design a custom tank, then outfit it with oem parts so the gas gauge reads correctly, stock fuel filler fills correctly, etc. Pros: it will have a much greater capacity, and will have no corrosion issues; cons: very much more time consuming, and will be just as expensive as a new stock replacement tank.

I once had a 57 Chevy panel 4x4 I designed a 60 gallon gas tank for that I was very happy with. If I get no more response to my questions about this gas tank as I did to my power steering questions here,
http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/basic-tech-questions/9999-general-power-steering-info-wanted.html
I'll just have to design my own gas tank as I have no idea about the proper way a stock gas tank should look or hook up.

Steve

p.s. Is this safe, or is there some safety factor/device/engineering I'm not aware of? I always thought gasoline tanks should be on the inside of the frame because if another vehicle ever runs into the side of your truck, you'll go up in the biggest ball of flames this side of 9-11. And I don't want to live the remainder of my life in the burn ward of a hospital. I've never had a truck with the gas tank on the outside of the frame. ...so little I know about IH trucks.

What about the old Ford pinto's ? They had rear end tanks, and would explode if hit in the rear ! ? a side tank is better than that ? the d-series truck's are on the outside of the frame . just too much thinking ? Jeff

 

[overdrivesteve]

what about the old Ford pinto's ? They had rear end tanks, and would explode if hit in the rear ! ? a side tank is better than that ? the d-series truck's are on the outside of the frame . just too much thinking ? Jeff[/quote ]

hi,

possibly true - just trying to think through things and with only a very limited frame of reference as mine is the only IH pick-up I've ever seen, and so many things are done so very wrong on this truck by po's, I never know for sure .

I've seen videos of the exploding pintos - mainly because the back of the car collapses on impact - much like the side of my truck would if hit from the side . don't want to be in that fireball . all I can say is its probably much less likely to be hit in the side as rear ended .

thanks .

steve

 

[overdrivesteve]

great looking truck my friend. Just started following it today. Curious though, do you have a manual for this truck? Have you thought about buying one? I bought one for my Scout II and it was like somebody turned on the light switch. This forum has a lot of great info but I would highly recommened a manual. I know the feeling with doing a driveway budget builder. The limitations suck! Hang in there with all the po finds. I have had my Scout for 2 years and still find stuff all fuged up. Look forward to more posts and hope you get that thing more on a "drivability" state. Even if its to the local liqour store for a 6 pack. Get that truck out there so it can be appreciated. Keep up the good work man. Kcco!

Hi chico,

great point - but yes, I do have a photocopy of the service manual for my truck, and a photocopy of the parts manual too. That was the first thing I got. I actually started my postings on another forum, so to support that forum, at that time I bought the photocopied manual from them.

However, the manual is not complete, and its missing some sections, and many sections are duplicates. The manual is setup like a lot of individual pamphlets. I think that's the way they did it for trucks in 62. Not only is the Scout line not touched upon in my service pamphlet manual collection, but many procedures are not mentioned - how to r n r the gas tank, the motor mounts, disassemble and reassemble the heater/vent controls, etc - things I can figure out, but take a lot more time with no IH experience and no frame of reference from manuals and clearly improperly done by previous owners over the years. But the service manual appears good for such things as setting the ring and pinion, etc.

The parts manual photocopy can also be very misleading - and the pictures are not very clear. For example, it shows the vent line of the gas tank going to a point near the filler cap, when in reality it apparently just is supposed to hang loose, exposed to the elements, per replies to my questions here:
http://forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/basic-tech-questions/9971-am-I-missing-something.html

This past week has been mostly spent in research, mostly on power steering conversions for my truck. I've had no time to do actual work on the truck. And as far as the fuel tank repair, I have the dilemma of fixing it properly or trying something custom.

It needs both filler hoses, both sold here. However, one is $78.95 and the other is $66.95 - $145 for just two hoses is a bit pricey - although that is the fair going market price for them.
fuel tank lower filler hose,front fender fill style, 61'-68' pickup/Travelall - International Scout parts
d-series lower fuel tank filler hose - International Scout parts

Consequently I'm going to take a chance that the filler shown below will work in place of the top hose. It's made for a 67-68 Ford mustang, but I went to the auto parts store with my filler plate, and a mustang gas cap fit it ok, so my gas cap should fit the mustang filler... I hope. The other years, in particular the 64 to 66 and 69 and later years do not have as much of a 90 degree bend. New, this metal filler is only $24.95 from a reputable mustang parts manufacturer (scott drake) and on ebay go for $15 to $45. Just need a cheap piece of straight fuel filler hose to connect it.

I'll let you know how it works out once it arrives and I have time to start working on the truck again.

Steve

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[87king]

Well on my b model truck it also has outside frame rails mounted saddle tanks. It wasn't so much that I was nervous about going up in flames but being right behind the front tire and hanging a bit low. When I redid the tank I had to patch 2 holes tig welded them up the po had super putty on them and had a few good dents from rocks flying up hitting the tank. Soo not wanting to damage the tank anymore or get stranded from a rock going through it or a tire blow out, I am going to make up a skid plate that wraps the tanks belly and upper front. I haven't mocked it up yet but have you thought about doing something like that?? You could make a full sided steel skid plate and underneath for that just in case situation to have aliatl more protection on impact? Just a thought like 3/16 plate should do in a emergency or 1/4

 

[FDChappie]

A nice set of rock sliders/running boards will solve the problem too.

 

[overdrivesteve]

well on my b model truck it also has outside frame rails mounted saddle tanks. It wasn't so much that I was nervous about going up in flames but being right behind the front tire and hanging a bit low. When I redid the tank I had to patch 2 holes tig welded them up the po had super putty on them and had a few good dents from rocks flying up hitting the tank. Soo not wanting to damage the tank anymore or get stranded from a rock going through it or a tire blow out, I am going to make up a skid plate that wraps the tanks belly and upper front. I haven't mocked it up yet but have you thought about doing something like that?? You could make a full sided steel skid plate and underneath for that just in case situation to have aliatl more protection on impact? Just a thought like 3/16 plate should do in a emergency or 1/4

a nice set of rock sliders/running boards will solve the problem too.

Hi,
great ideas. Actually I was thinking to eventually make something using both those ideas - perhaps a 1/4 inch box wrapped around the entire gas tank, except for the side facing the rear differential. That way if anyone really smashes into the side of the truck, it will blow out towards the back. And with a good solid rock slider, that should give all the more protection.

I used to know someone who worked for a tow yard with a police impound contract. Because usually freeway crashes are cleaned up and gone in a half hour, most people don't realize how many there really are, and how bad they can get. He used to give me regular tours of all the new crashed cars and trucks in the yard when I went to visit.

But I think the most gruesome thing I ever saw there was a totaled near-new mercedes. But it was not totaled because of a crash. There wasn't a scratch on the car, the windows were all rolled up, and it ran just fine.
It was totaled because someone blew their brains out in it - literally. Part of their skull and scalp was embedded in the roof of the car, and brains and blood were splattered throughout the inside of the car. In addition to the blood, the inside of all the windows, especially the drivers side window clearly had brain and skull pieces coating it. The rank smell was indescribable. He said when the police and coroner were there they all had lit cigarettes in their mouth trying to hide some of the smell. Per law they had to keep that vehicle sitting there, cooking in the hot sun for 30 days.

I've made a gas tank in the past, a big 56 gallon tank put behind the differential of a 1 ton 4x4 57 chev panel truck. It went from frame rail to frame rail, and about an inch from the bottom of the floor it hung down to about the height of the rear axle tubes. Even though it was put between the frame rails, and had protection from strong cross channel iron from the tow hitch on the back end of the frame, I still used a steel skid plate, but never anything as thick as 1/4 inch, and it was still strong enough to put a jack under and lift the entire back end of the truck.

But this crew cab truck does not have much after-differential overhang, so whatever size tank I put back there, I will still want a gas tank on each frame side too.

But first I need to make the truck a dependable driver, then I can work on these fun modifications.

Steve

I wonder if anyone dares to give me a like on this post...