Took off the valve covers...oh boy...

S

SR2dude

Member
I took off the valve covers the other day and it appears that the po never changed the dang oil. I definitely have some work ahead of me.

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Luckily I have a Scout II that has a 304 in good condition that I might switch over to my 800. Not sure what I want to do yet. Any opinions or suggestions are welcome.

Also, do the 304 engines usually run hot? I put on a new temp gauge and it reads that it it runs hot.

D
 
Yuck, what a mess!

The use of a good heavy duty detergent oil will go a long way towards cleaning that mess up.

Ihc engines, if anything, run on the colder side. If your engine is running hot then several possibilities come to mind.

The first thought that comes to mind is if your oil system is that gunked up I would imagine your cooling system isn't much better.

If your radiator is gunked up it won't be able to cool properly. You should have at least a 20* differential in the temp of the coolant going in and the coolant going out.

If your thermostat is gunked up it won't allow proper flow to the radiator for proper cooling.

Using an infrared thermometer is a great tool to determine what temps you are having and where things are hot and where things aren't hot.
 
sr2dude said:
I took off the valve covers the other day and it appears that the po never changed the dang oil. I definitely have some work ahead of me.

17277_406843185246_659970246_10582080_3724658_n.jpg


Luckily I have a Scout II that has a 304 in good condition that I might switch over to my 800. Not sure what I want to do yet. Any opinions or suggestions are welcome.

Also, do the 304 engines usually run hot? I put on a new temp gauge and it reads that it it runs hot.

D
Click to expand...

Looks kinda normal regarding po-abused motors I see like that nearly every week here!

Not only are the rocker shaft assemblies gonna look the same inside (resulting in non-oilers like we discuss so often around here!), the oil pump pickup "float" (which doesn't really float on these engines!!) is gonna be super-clogged up also, that is a significant concern.

So...drop the pan and douche the bottom end also!
 
I plan on dropping the pan and cleaning everything in there. The oil was terrible, it was about the same color of black as the background of this forum! So sad.

As far as the cooling, I just changed the thermostat and put in some new coolant and it made a bit of a difference. I might be swapping engines completely depending on what else I can find wrong with this engine so if I do that I am going to get a new radiator as well.

Thanks for the input!
 
You should also consider pulling a few rod and main bearing caps while the pan is off. Surly the engine has suffered from oil starvation issues due to a blocked oil pick up and or oil filter.

If you see alot of copper dig deeper.
If the crank looks ok you can roll in new bearings without yanking the engine. Look for scoring or a step on the crank journal. You will be able to feel it with a finger tip or if you are equiped, a micrometer.

My opinoin is to yank it and rebuild the bugger. Or freshen it up with bearings rings and gaskets. Could get away for not much if you do it your self.
 
Im taking apart my engine. I am down to the block as of now and there is so much oil/dirt and gunk all over from a leak somewhere. Its all over the starter, the front of the engine and on the axle and drive shaft, everywhere! I might be pulling the engine completely to clean it all and make sure it is all working now. Also my Scout had the nasty undercoating stuff put on it to prevent the rust so a lot of the mess is from that. My question, is there a chemical or cleaning something that I can spray on and it all comes off? I just want it to look good when I open the hood. I am sick of seeing it extremely dirty.
 
So you have the heads off? If not now is the time to clean it. If so it good time to see if the bores are real worn. You May need to remove the carbon build up that is at the very top of the cylinders to feel a ridge. If you can not feel a slight step or just a very slight step you are probably safe to clean it up regasket and after inspecting a couple of bearings just put'er back together and run it.

If you want an opinion, post a couple of good pix and we can try to give one to you.

As for a good cleaner for the oil and goo I like the orange capped gunk engine cleaner. It still has solvent in it so still soaks in and cleans. Spray it down with gunk fist and let it soak in for a couple of hours then hit it with a pressure washer. That is about all you can do with the 35 year old baked on oil. It will not likely all come off but at least you can say you tried. :icon_rolleyes:
 
If I power washed it all down do I have to worry about any water getting anywhere in the engine like down in the crank? And yes, the heads are off.
 
Yea, if the heads are off I would not blast it much but then again I can be a pita that way.

You can use the cleaner and brush it to loosen the goo then carefully spray down and away from the openings. Just cover it as well as possible. I assume the pan will be coming off and you will be able to remove any contamination.

For me? I'd yank it and have your way with it. A lot easier to do the stuff while standing next to it.
 
Yuk! But I have seen worse in a good running engine so don't sweat it if it's running. Lots of ways to clean it with additives, detergent oil and good filters!
 
A quick update with where I am at! Working on taking off all the crap that is stuck on in the engine bay, getting on some new parts and gaskets. Then hopefully I am gonna be putting it back together!

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I know the valves look like they are rusted but they are not and now have rags stuffed in them and I sprayed a special lubricant that keeps it clean and oiled, I cant remember what it is called tho. It works great!
 
I'm going to make this thread my official build thread!

I am going to make this my "build" thread.

I forgot also I dropped the oil pan and and there was easily 2 inches of gunk in the bottom. Its clean now tho!
 
Do yourself a big favor...snake a scotch roloc kit at the local parts house that includes the rubberized abrasive "bristle brushes". This is a quick-change arbor that accepts both the brushes and the scotchbrite pads in different grades. Makes quick work of cleaning up the head and block mating surfaces.

I use this stuff all day long in the shop for removing gasket material, carbon, whatever. All those abrasives will remove metal if you are not careful, so ya need to scrap as much grunge off mechanically as ya can, then finish off with the scotchbrite products.

You do not want to use any type of oil additive "solvent" inside the engine! That shit will quickly break down some deposits and end up clogging an oil filter and the oil pump pickup before ya know it resulting in oil starvation! But for the most part will not do anything other than potentially create an engine lubrication failure. If the shit is stuck inside the motor, who gives a shit if it's there, it hurts nothing! The only way to remove "stuff" inside an engine is tear it down and mechanically clean, there is no magic bullet for this condition!
 
So I have the whole engine bay cleaned up and looking good! I painted some areas black but for the most past used a rag and some cleaning detergent. It looks great now from what it used to look like. My next step now is getting some new gaskets for everything and put it all together again.

The push rods were taken out and not marked what lifter they came out of. Is there anything I have to worry about with putting them back in at random? I know the all have there own wear patterns and dont want anything to break or have anything bad happen to it.

I also am using some different rockers since mine were way to dirty to attempt cleaning. I took another pair off of an 800 with a 304. Is there anything I need to worry about with putting in new rockers?

I heard that if the wear pattern on the rockers/lifters/pushrods is different there will be some noises and possibly something could break? Any help on this one?

Thanks!
 
The push rods won't care where they are placed. The lifters are a big issue however. They must be returned to the lobe they were run on. Only if the cam is barley run in can you consider new lifters. The break in beds the lifter in to the new lobe so they rotate properly and have a large contact patch.

If a new lifter is placed on an old cam the contact patch will be only at the high places and the pair will be likely to score and die quickly. Some do get lucky but I have never been.

If you can't return them to where they cam I strongly recommend investing in a new cam and lifters.


Sorry for the bad news and missing your initial question.
 
sr2dude said:
the push rods were taken out and not marked what lifter they came out of. Is there anything I have to worry about with putting them back in at random? I know the all have there own wear patterns and dont want anything to break or have anything bad happen to it.
Click to expand...

I might be miss understanding what you have removed and want/need to replace.
So, the lifters are in the correct as run locations? You only are unsure regarding the push rod original location?? If so you can reassemble as it is without issue.

Regarding the replacement rocker assemblies I would follow mr Maybens cleaning recommendations before putting things back together.
http://www.forums.IHPartsAmerica.co...I-4-sv-engine-non-oiling-rocker-assembly.html
 
Oh ok I get it now. I misunderstood you also. The lifters are in the original location just not the push rods. So its ok putting the push rods in any lifter?
 
Whats the best way to clean out the lifters? I need to clean the where the push rod and the lifter meet. Any ideas? There is just some dirty oil and crap in them. I tried using a vacum but that didnt work. Im trying to get a picture up but something is up with my camera. Thanks

d
 
One at a time, remove and invert the lifter and shoot it off with carb or brake cleaner till hte crap is washed off. Don't blast the little hole on the side if possible..

Check the cam and wear face for any obvious damage while you have it out.

Blow off with air, reoil and replace into its respective bore. If you have any grease, grease the lifter face too.
 
I use a strong telescoping magnet (1/2 diameter). They sell a lifter extraction tool and most autoparts stores but I don't own one.. Can't tell you why but I have always gotten by without.
You can sometimes hook the retainer groove/undercut with a right angle pick or similar..
 
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