My 14th IH owned, the '73 1110 4WD T-all

wagnmastr said:
I'm gonna use the distributor from the current 392. The 345 was gonna require using the 'gold box'.
Timing should be good here. I hope to remove the engine over the weekend and get to cleaning out the oil that is everywhere (to make way for new oil to be spewed everywhere at a later date)!
The 345 probably won't go in until the following.
Click to expand...

Yep, ya gotta ton of work facing you in cleaning up the engine bay! But at least that one is original and not some botch job left over from someonelse's failed project.

And...ya need to service the tranny while it's out and accessible.

I agree about the distributor. I was expecting to find that the donor engine unit had a gold box which would only complicate the matter, that is why I asked. With the point distributor you just drop it in and go. I pulled the cap off that distributor and it's been serviced internally in recent history! If ya end up keeping this rig for more than a few months, ya can install a pertronix later on if desired.

Check yore chains and connections for the hoist twice before applying the pressure! While yore pulling the motor at yore end, I'll be pulling a 392 out of the rotten junker parts rig I bought after your t-all left here. That motor is a core only, though it is a virgin and has no po workarounds. It's an ic version, so it will be kept here for a future buildup. That rig spent the last 10 years hidden away in a filbert orchard, it was parked after the front spring hangers sheared (common on fullsize stuff) and left it a cripple.
 

Attachments

  • 1210 junker.jpg
    1210 junker.jpg
    84.6 KB · Views: 454
You have a link handy for the servicing you think the 727 might need? You're not meaning yanking the tranny, right? Would it be this thread? T407/tf 727 band adjustment

this time around I will be using an engine lift plate bolted to the intake manifold, and use real chain instead of one step up from a swag for a ceiling fan!

I think this 392 was an ic, too.
 
Here's the link to the 727 "service " thread. You can do this without the small torque wrench but I'll have to talk ya through it by phone. The pan has to come off for band adjustment, and you will need a pan gasket and filter to go back in, along with about 7qts. Of tranny oil. I'm 98% certain that will "fix" the slow engagement of the trans.

I thought you were going to pull the trans along with the 392 engine?? That makes service much easier. But which ever method you use, you must keep the torque converter pushed back into position so ya don't mess up the pump engagement of the converter-to-transmission.

Yes, the 392 that is currently in the t'all is an ic version, seems like when I looked at the numbers on that one, the vehicle was an August/'73 production date...which means it was right in the transition period over to the "temporary" 401 amc engine being used in the 2x4 t'alls. I've found nothing to confirm that the 401 was used in the 4x4 t'alls or any units with the higher gvw ratings.
 
michael mayben said:
yes, the 392 that is currently in the t'all is an ic version, seems like when I looked at the numbers on that one, the vehicle was an August/'73 production date...which means it was right in the transition period over to the "temporary" 401 amc engine being used in the 2x4 t'alls. I've found nothing to confirm that the 401 was used in the 4x4 t'alls or any units with the higher gvw ratings.
Click to expand...

For histerical reference, the IH salesman offered me the option of the amc 401 for my 73 t/a when I ordered it in March 1973.

1210 / 2wd / 8200 gvw

built in May 1973.
 
I've got the engine on the hoist, and I have unbolted the six bolts to the flywheel housing and removed the dob-bone front engine struts.
I believe I have to move the engine forward some first and it also looks like I'll have to remove the oil pan in hopes of clearing the front crossmemeber where the struts were mounted.
Is there anything else I should consider before moving ahead?
Sorry, but this is my first time yanking an engine solo, and the others who helped in the past did most of this part, so any insight would be very helpful!
 
I've been concentrating on homestead chores man and haven't spent much time around here this weekend. I see ya called sometime yesterday tjough!

Prolly got the motor out by now,...but there are four bolt that retain the torque converter to the flex plate that enter from the "front" of the flexplate after you remove the dust cover. Those need to be removed so the torque converter can stay inside the bellhousing, we'd rather the tc did not come out of the trans at this point.

Then the engine will come forward about three inches as you come up with it by manipulating the lift. Keep the engine level coming out and when going back in (level means that if the front of the truck is raised up for access, then the front of the engine has to be raised also as it comes up).

Normally the oil pan can stay in place since you move it right up against the crossmember before lifting out of the hole, if it touches the crossmember, that is no big deal, just don't let it bang hard and dent it, you are gonna need that pan!
 
Weeeelllll,
thanks for the reply. I took off the oil pan and oil pump, but didn't take off the torque converter. It still came out straight and a lot easier than I thought it would be for just one guy doing it. Hope I didn't damage anything.
Note I already put on my new 31x10.5's off the wagonmaster onto the rims I just snagged. I couldn't wait.
Here are a couple pics...
 

Attachments

  • DSCF9562.jpg
    DSCF9562.jpg
    93.6 KB · Views: 321
  • DSCF9569.jpg
    DSCF9569.jpg
    89.1 KB · Views: 296
  • DSCF9573.jpg
    DSCF9573.jpg
    74.4 KB · Views: 320
Get the snout of that torque converter sealed up using that duktape! Do the same on the input side of the tranny, ya gotta keep any kinda stuff out of both at all costs!

Go ahead and remove the torque converter now, if you turn it "hub down" you will drain oil out the snout so be careful.

Once everything is cleaned up and you are ready to install the other motor, then you will need to install the converter onto the trans first, making sure it's fully engaged, and then put some sort of retainer on one of the small dust cover holes to keep it pushed back until the motor is bolted completely to the bell, then you will bring it forward and engage with the flex plate. See these threads so ya don't end up breaking the inner rotor on the tranny oil pump:

http://www.forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/transmission-tech/5136-2-differant-727s.html

And:

http://www.forums.IHPartsAmerica.com/transmission-tech/1679-727-tc-r-r.html
 
Open bell housing is sealed up, converter, too.
Putty knife and degreaser is working like a charm on the frame and stuff. Almost 1/8" thick in spots! Yummy!
Mm, I think you mentioned black satin paint does the trick in the engine compartment but can't recall the name you prefer. I think you also mentioned the one close to IH red if I elect to paint the oil pan once I clear that out. I imagine the brand they sell at the local tractor supply that's IH red is more for exterior where there isn't much heat or oily conditions.
Any thoughts on rattle can ceramic hi-temp on exhaust manifolds? What sort of prep should I do on them first?
Not trying to make this rig look too spiffy, just better than it did.

Oh, and to answer a previous question - the choke stove/connecting rod is on the 4bbl Holley on the 392, but there isn't one on the 345. Will that work?
 
Last edited:
Ok, I'll send you the proper choke stove setup for a 345/2210 carb. The one on the 392 could be made to work though the bend in the rod is not correct and I hate to butcher stuff that you are going to use in the future if you build that engine.

The "red" paint I use is van sickle implement enamel from most farm/ag supply stores. It's the case/IH red stuff, I'm not particular as to which of the eight or so different "IH red" formulas I use, but the van sickle stuff is definitely a superior product. I use it for all engine "paint" applications, but it will eventually burn off any exhaust manifold. No need at all for any "engine paint" formulation, that stuff is a waste compared to implement enamel.

I've also tried to use the stuff many commercial engine builders use, that "aervoe" stuff and find it nowhere near in the same league as van sickle, so I'm done with that product.

Personally, unless the exhaust manifolds are done in ceramic, I think anyone is just wasting time. To have any luck with the various rattlecan coatings, they need to be media blasted and then run through the dishwasher to remove the blasting dust from the pores. Then the stuff will burn off anyway, just takes longer.

The semi-gloss or "satin" black I use and keep here is plain old krylon "rust tough" in "semi-flat". It's an absolute perfect match to that high end "chassis black" you see on frame-off restos. Some refer to that stuff as "GM chassis black". I've used the chassis black in rattle cans, locally I find it at the only auto body supply warehouse in the area, it's a specialty/trade product used for touch-up and is about $12 a can, the krylon is absolutely the same color/tone and appearance when applied over that stuff.

I've also put a couple of sticks of that welding rod in the box for ya in case ya need to rebuild the tailgate latch system. Mine totally took a dump again last Friday, so I had to gutout the tailgate again, remove all the latches again and polish everything this time and give the schnizz some deep lubrication. So I replaced the latch "wires" again and now it works like new.
 
Here's a quick update -
I've pressure washed the engine compartment, rattle canned the frame and such in black semi gloss. I've also removed the flexplate and flywheel from the 2 engines. I will likely reuse the bolts and will clean them with a wire wheel first. Also, I've swabbed out their bolt holes with alcohol using q-tips. I'll use permatex #2 when I put those items back together.
I also have everything off the 392 and cleaned up, ready to put onto the 345. Oops, except for the dipstick.
And, today I got a few minutes to pressure wash the 345.
Still haven't seen that care pkg with the carb and the oil pump tool for prelubing the engine!
I think that is about all I can do until the box shows up.
 
wagnmastr said:
here's a quick update -
I've pressure washed the engine compartment, rattle canned the frame and such in black semi gloss. I've also removed the flexplate and flywheel from the 2 engines. I will likely reuse the bolts and will clean them with a wire wheel first. Also, I've swabbed out their bolt holes with alcohol using q-tips. I'll use permatex #2 when I put those items back together.
I also have everything off the 392 and cleaned up, ready to put onto the 345. Oops, except for the dipstick.
And, today I got a few minutes to pressure wash the 345.
Still haven't seen that care pkg with the carb and the oil pump tool for prelubing the engine!
I think that is about all I can do until the box shows up.
Click to expand...

I just finished a second 2210 carb for your "experiment". The first one turned out to be shit!

I'm rushing now to get the box to the p.o. In the big city so it will leave tonite, but I May not make it. We've been hit with some snow over the last two days and the roads are now clearing up some so I don't know what the sitch is in town.
 
Today I dropped the oil pan in the 345, removed the oil pump and fitted the pump from the 392 onto the 345.
I also removed the valve cover gaskets in preparation for running my electric drill on the oil pump for 10 minutes and getting the 345 lubed up, following the procedures laid out in the 'old IH iron' doc.

Questions: how do I remove the dipstick tube off the 392 (that is in the front passenger spot adjacent to the fuel pump), and how do I remove what appears to be a metal plug in the same spot on the 345?
 
wagnmastr said:
today I dropped the oil pan in the 345, removed the oil pump and fitted the pump from the 392 onto the 345.
I also removed the valve cover gaskets in preparation for running my electric drill on the oil pump for 10 minutes and getting the 345 lubed up, following the procedures laid out in the 'old IH iron' doc.

Questions: how do I remove the dipstick tube off the 392 (that is in the front passenger spot adjacent to the fuel pump), and how do I remove what appears to be a metal plug in the same spot on the 345?
Click to expand...

The dip stick tube on the 392 "front stick" is simply "pressed" into the block with a light interference fit. Gently work it back and forth and around while pulling up, you May need to rig a prybar on it with a pair of vise-grips for a pry-point, but do so gently.

This is the "topic" I was trying to remember to discuss with you yesterday when the battery died on my phone!

The "plug" in the 345 block is either an aluminum plug or a steel plug that looks like a rivet (I think it originally was some pattern of a rivet).

By far, the easiest way to deal with this is using a long drift from inside and driving the plug up and out. Even if there was room to clamp on vise-grips, I don't think you could pull the plug out.

Use that same sealant you used on the flex-plate bolts and wipe some on the dip stick tube before inserting into the 345 block as insurance.

This is the "topic" was trying to remember to discuss with you yesterday when the battery died on my phone!
 
Getting pretty far along here. I put on the dipstick, checked for proper lubrication of left and right rockers by going thru that 'old IH iron' doc, buttoned back up the valve covers, mounted the a/c bracket and alternator, and power steering pump, and pulleys. The fan is just loosely bolted for the moment.
I've also been cutting new heater hose, etc, getting ready for the new hookups.
I have the rpt engine struts mounted and think I am about ready to drop the engine back in place. The rebuilt carb showed up last week (thanks mm!) and things are looking good to put her this weekend.
Though I've been trying to do this as cheaply as possible, I am trying to get this replacement engine in with as few snags down the road, so it is taking a bit longer to get in than I'd like.
Oh yeah, I am going to adjust the 727 transmission bands before I put the engine back in. I hear it's a lot easier to get to the kickodwn one that way. Just waiting for my in/lb torque wrench to show up from harbor freight. Should be here in time for this weekend.
 
Last edited:
Michael,
you don't know the part number for that choke thermostat for the carb, do you? I think you were gonna send one down, as I don't know if the one from the 392 is the right app.
 
Mm - thanks for the heads up on proper seating of the torque converter. I've got the 345 bolted in, but lost too much daylight on it to get much further. If it doesn't rain much tomorrow, I might get a chance to bolt the torque converter on to the flywheel, put on the cover and do the exhaust and radiator bolt on. Next will be the carb, linkage and vacuum hoses, then electrical. But that's a dream getting all that done tomorrow. I used up too much 'me' time today getting the engine in. But it was worth it!
 
Does anyone have a part # for an exahust regulator gasket number, ,a.k.a. Heat riser gasket?
I haven't found a hit at napa or rockauto.com. Wonder if I can get one from anywhere besides sss?
 
I went ahead and bought a metal heat riser gasket and metal donuts through super scouts. I wasn't able to find them anywhere else, and from what I understand, the fiber ones you can get break down rather quickly. Prices were $12 for heat riser gasket and $19 each for the donuts.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top