Scout 80 U Bolts

[Josh Shoemaker]

I was wondering if the online store has u bolts for the stock suspension for the 80? I have looked and there are some u bolts but it looks like they are only for the Scout II. Mine had to be cut off with the torch. Thanks in advance.

 

[Michael Mayben]

I was wondering if the online store has u bolts for the stock suspension for the 80? I have looked and there are some u bolts but it looks like they are only for the Scout II. Mine had to be cut off with the torch. Thanks in advance.

Josh...for the s80, the spring u bolts front and rear (and side-to-side) vary, they are not all the same size/pattern.

So I think you are wanting to replace all is that correct? If so, post which rear axle you are going to end up using, the d27 unit or the d44 offset unit. And we need to know if you are going to retain the oem springs and spring pack thickness, and also retaining the oem spring plates?

We just wanna make sure we help ya with the right stuff from the git-go, many folks have hashed these things over so much there is no telling what ya got now! I'm following your build-up thread and I know you are not doing a full-on correct restoration.

Also in this same light, I did some inexpensive upgrades for all this stuff on my own s80 that keeps the oem appearance, provides a slight lift, improves steering feel and return, and really beefs the spring mounting scenario, I can share that with ya if interested, all the pieces for doing that are on the shelf at ihon. At this point I'm retaining the oem springs, though in the future I'll most likely add one additional leaf to each spring.

 

[Josh Shoemaker]

josh...for the s80, the spring u bolts front and rear (and side-to-side) vary, they are not all the same size/pattern.

So I think you are wanting to replace all is that correct? If so, post which rear axle you are going to end up using, the d27 unit or the d44 offset unit. And we need to know if you are going to retain the oem springs and spring pack thickness, and also retaining the oem spring plates?

We just wanna make sure we help ya with the right stuff from the git-go, many folks have hashed these things over so much there is no telling what ya got now! I'm following your build-up thread and I know you are not doing a full-on correct restoration.


Also in this same light, I did some inexpensive upgrades for all this stuff on my own s80 that keeps the oem appearance, provides a slight lift, improves steering feel and return, and really beefs the spring mounting scenario, I can share that with ya if interested, all the pieces for doing that are on the shelf at ihon. At this point I'm retaining the oem springs, though in the future I'll most likely add one additional leaf to each spring.

I have the Dana 27 front and rear. I will be using the stock springs. I would have reused the u bolts but I had to cut them off. And I just want to replace them.

But on the same note when I was removing the steering linkage I saw that it was bent and I need to replace it also.

So your last does have my attention. So if you can explain what you did to yours would be great.. I wished I had taken some pictures of these items.

 

[Michael Mayben]

I have the Dana 27 front and rear. I will be using the stock springs. I would have reused the u bolts but I had to cut them off. And I just want to replace them.

But on the same note when I was removing the steering linkage I saw that it was bent and I need to replace it also.

So your last does have my attention. So if you can explain what you did to yours would be great.. I wished I had taken some pictures of these items.

I forgot about ya! I'm so far behind with customer responses and "tech stuff" I don't know who's next! My "triage" system suks!

Let me describe what I've done on our s80, and that was with much assistance and recommendation from Jeff at the time since he knew we were on a budget and this rig is not a daily driver but just a toy. Someday it May be a dd on occasion though! The springs are oem and I have no reason to change those off at this point. D27 of course up front, with the option d44 offset pumpkin in the rear but that doesn't matter here.

We used CPT 6* caster wedges (steel) made for Scout II width springs. Idea was to achieve a steering system that "self-centered" coming pout of a turn and to add much greater forward stability going down the road to cure the oem "wander" syndrome that comes with the weird-ass alignment specs.

Also sourced were the monster 5" CPT shackles for all four positions (identical), along with the poly spring bushing sets available from ihon. To go with that package, we threw in the box a pair of extra-long universal spring center pins that were cut to length after the entire system was mounted.

The caster wedges were then jigged onto the oem spring plates and drilled. By doing this, there is no possible way that the wedges can ever become dislodged!

 

[Michael Mayben]

Here's a shot of a caster wedge jigged in place and retained by the spring center pin. Do not ever use aluminum or zinc caster wedges on any vehicle, only steel!

 

[Michael Mayben]

These are the totally bulletproof CPT spring shackles with the center stabilizer which is imperative for proper operation and maintaining spring/axle alignment. The units are 5", I'd not go any longer for this application as the shackle length affects axle/wheel alignment as the rig articulates dynamically.

The 5" shackle combined with the 6* wedge provides excellent forward stability, along with complete self-centering of the steering wheel coming out of a turn. The steering gear on these rigs is pretty crude with much internal friction, and that combined with no caster to the alignment spec's means they are a handful to operate in the tight woods, rocks, etc. I have no idea what the actual caster readout on this system is right now, but it is a vast improvement over oem handling-wise!

 

[Michael Mayben]

Here's a crappy pic of the installed front end stuff. I lost the good pics in a hd crash a few years ago.

Maybe someday the entire rig will be dismantled for a total cleanup like your's, but for now it's primarily used as a tractor and dump truck/stump puller here, and it's soon gonna see the 152 stroker motor/t-18 four speed transplant also. Mechanically it's perfect and every point has been addressed/serviced/rebuilt/worked-around, most notably the entire electrical system which was the first thang that got ripped out!

 

[Michael Mayben]

This was a quick comparison shot before I installed the rear shackles (5" also) and poly spring bushings. These are oem-size tires on the oem wheels (15" , not 16").

The fender gap is easily discerned on the front end as compared to oem, originally it matched the rear fender gap and the rig set completely level.

Once the rear shackles were installed, the rig is still level, total overall lift is about 2" which is all we want, that clears tires really nicely. We'll end up using new tall (old skool)tires on it, but the wheels need considerable offset. The problem with these rigs is the inside of the front tires rubbing the springs. But careful wheel/tire selection can eliminate that. I have junker 32" tires on it now mounted to some oldskool "deep reverse" (offset) wheels which clear everything just fine.

 

[Michael Mayben]

Now back to your original question..."u" bolts!

Because of the addition of the caster wedges (and I was originally gonna add a couple of leaves to the springs but didn't), I replaced all the "u" bolts with off-the-shelf stuff from my local supplier who makes 'em up to order. I also have a local source that has virtually ever "u" bolt you would ever need for a stocker hanging on the wall!

For retaining all the oem suspension stuff, I'll have to retrieve the measurements of the "u" bolts and get back to ya. Jeff May already have that data on hand and will know the sizes for a full set for both front and rear on a pair of d27 for a s80.

 

[Josh Shoemaker]

Hey michael that is excatly what I am looking for. I want a little bit of a lift that is simple, but not enought that I have to start changing springs, steering, driveshafts, etc.

I am going to go that route.



The tires that was on the Scout are pretty much what I want to stay with. I do have that problem with the front tires rubbing into the springs. My orginal plan was to use the wheels that I have on it. I was going to sandblast them and powdercoat them black just to save a little money. But that was before I found out about the rubbing issuse.

Can I use a spacer to step the wheel out. Or would it be best just to order a new set of wheels and tire with the proper backspacing?

 

[Michael Mayben]

hey michael that is excatly what I am looking for. I want a little bit of a lift that is simple, but not enought that I have to start changing springs, steering, driveshafts, etc.

I am going to go that route.



The tires that was on the Scout are pretty much what I want to stay with. I do have that problem with the front tires rubbing into the springs. My orginal plan was to use the wheels that I have on it. I was going to sandblast them and powdercoat them black just to save a little money. But that was before I found out about the rubbing issuse.

Can I use a spacer to step the wheel out. Or would it be best just to order a new set of wheels and tire with the proper backspacing?

Overlooked your thread again josh, sorry!

I've tried the 1/4" thick wheel spacer for correcting the tire rub issue, it won't help! And that would be all that is safe to use. There are some engineered spacers available that bolt on and are safe to use, up to 1.5" in offset. But....that puts the centerline of the wheel/tire well outboard of the hub bearing set, greatly increasing load on the hub components (I'm talking the actual hub, not the locking unit).

And to be safe when using spacers, I install new, longer wheel studs and use closed end (acorn) lug nuts to protect the ends of the studs from mud and salt-slush.

The best solution is simply a set of wheels that have adequate backspacing to get the tires away from the springs.

The closed knuckle axle doesn't have all that much turning angle built in, the later open knuckle axles (also referred to by ihc as the "40* axles) allow much more turn angle which compounds the issue!

This same thing is encountered on fullsize rigs with the steering draglink that runs parallel to the frame, the inside of the driver side tire rubs on the draglink in a full lock turn of the steering.

Also, this spring rub issue has a lot to do with tire selection, with "tall/skinny" ya won't have that problem on the stock wheels.

 

[Josh Shoemaker]

I got my shackles and bushings Monday of this week. There are at the powdercoater right now. So I should see them back this week. Thanks to you and Jeff. I hope to get back on this project.

I had all the windows changed out this past Saturday. (trying to get back some of my taxes) this weekend I got a dirtbike/camping trip planned with some friends. And the week of the 26th I will be out of town for work. Hope to be on this May 1st.