Limited slip differential

Jeff ive been working on vehicles way longer than you. Way longer . . .
Since 1970.
Burbank 4wheel drive -74-76
conferr- 77-80
80-86- my own shop
86 -92- claudeshortdodge
92 -present- my ownshop
Done everything there is to do with a vehicle especially 4 wd. Burbank 4wd was the leader in conversions 2 to 4wd, back in those days.
Almost every datsun, toyota p/u conversion on the road then, we did it!

Maybe you need to read and understand!
It was a real strange occurance, and no question about how a powrlock works., but that doesnt change the facts, as to what happened- that day- to my Scout!
Nothing was broken anywhere in the drivetrain.
As the vehicle high centered,
both axles assys.[front and rear] Quit turning the wheels!
I got out of the Scout and looked underneath and saw the driveshafts turning, but none of the wheels. Made me scratch my head!
Both hubs were engaged on the d30 closed knuckle, so I couldnt see if the axles were turning.
No shorn keyways on two piece rear flanged axles, nothing broken inside either diff housing.
['cause when I got home, I pulled the housing covers and looked. And I drove it home 200 miles, after]
It isnt supposed to do that, yet it did!
Sure its possible that a axle assembly failed, but both simultaenously?
All the dunebuggy drivers that were there that day, watching me climb, were astounded also.
We pushed my vehicle off the rocks, and when all 4 wheels were solidly back on the ground, I had tractive power to the wheels again.
That was easter weekend, 1975 south part of anza borrego park, my 67 Scout w/v-266/ t-18/d-18,44 rear,30 front both w/powrlocks
now as to facts-
all things mechanical or electrical break.
Having /driving a '4 wheeldrive' vehicle without a positive traction device in both axle assys. Means = no 4 wheel drive!
Any air or electric engaged diff, has a lot of parts that can fail at any time. Hoses or wires can seperate, get pulled off, the servo can break, the switch or air pump can break, etc.
Another source for contaminents to enter axle assy.
Gear and clutch engaged diffs can stop working at anytime -like my example.
So- in my experience and knowledge, ive chosen detroit lockers, because when its= 'need it to work and get your vehicle moving/unstuck',
why take a chance on lots of parts having to work without failure.
Keep it simple!= detroit locker.
Cant handle the whiplash? Get a neck collar at sav-on drugstore! Wear it!
 
So back when I was a kid and had one of my teeth fall out I would stick it under my pillow right before bedtime and magically there would be some money under my pillow the next morning. Because I didn't hear or see anything that must mean the tooth fairy is real. I even shared my bedroom with one of my brothers who never saw anything so it must be true.

Regardless mechanical energy cannot disappear like a fart in the wind. Must have been some good acid back in the day, huh? Take your bullshit elsewhere!
 
Here's a good one for michael and Jeff or anyone else for that matter. I found the bom number on my front axle on my 74 Scout and I can't find the number on the Dana x510-8 pdf file. Here's the number
24 4a4 603427-8
I checked this number with a magnifieing glass twice I am sure it's right. I even searched the Dana sight no luck.
Sorry to beat an old dog again.
Ron
 
Are you sure 603427 is the correct Number.
I've found this manual to be pretty helpful in the past:
http://www2.Dana.com/pdf/x510-8.pdf
Anyway, the number you posted does not exist there, though there are some that are close.
One thing I've done in the past to get difficult numbers is clean the area and rub in uv dye check. Then wipe it clean and view with a uv light, it's amazing what the light will turn up.
 
Last edited:
Yea greg, I wire brushed the tube until shiny the numbers a clearly visible. I wrote them down and searched the same pdf file you are refering to. It threw me off too so I went back to the shop with a magifying glass and got the same numbers. According to the cover it looks just like the rear axle so I asume its a d44. I read somewhere that IH used to put d30's on front until 73 0r 74 then started using the same axle front and rear. But a d30 cover is smaller and round not like a d44, right?
Anyway the non-listed number I thought might be a challenge.
Line ticket should be here some time next week, I hope.
Thanks for the reply
ron
 
You are correct on the covers, and many times 2 digit numbers will be in the housing casting. I wish I was more help, but your LST will be the definitive answer. That's assuming the axle is original. The LST will have IH axle codes, but I've got a list of those and there's also info in the FAQ's at the binder bulletin.
 
Thanks greg, I have got to but a new pinion seal in, leaking a little but one for a d44 should work just fine. I will post when I get my line ticket.
 
I've called the tech dude at Dana before to identify a bom on an axle. I could'nt find it anywhere in the Dana info. The guy at Dana was a big help.
 
That number sequence falls in the range of several Ford apps for a square Bronco.

I've made a note and I'll check on it when I'm in town on Monday. Only a small portion of all the available Dana/spicer literature is available in their online knowledge base.

For a quick axle I.d. Tool, try this link:

differentials - gasket identification
 
I got the seal installed yesterday, I thought I would post these pics since the bom seems to be somewhat off the wall for a Scout. No need to id anymore I got what I needed. So thanks for your time.
 

Attachments

  • Front Axle BOM.jpg
    Front Axle BOM.jpg
    14.7 KB · Views: 403
  • Front Axle.jpg
    Front Axle.jpg
    87 KB · Views: 434
Jeff or whom ever, I have talked about changing my d44's to a locking diff, I am probable shooting myself in the foot for posting it but here it goes. I found what is described as detriot lockers on ebay with a 5.12 ratio. "like new condition" I am sure they are worth a pretty penny. My question is they should work in my d44's also I should be able to use my ring and pinion set. I just not sure about going from a 3.31 to a 5.12 ratio. What would that do gear it down or up?

ebay motors: Dana 44 Jeep/Scout detroit locker posi front and rear (item 170252989715 end time aug-26-08 16:14:31 pdt)

Jeff please don't take offense to buying off of ebay instead from you. But I am a cheap sob.:icon_mrgreen: :icon_mrgreen:
 
No offense taken. Your 3.31 gears will not work with these lockers which are a detroit and what appears to be a tru-trac limited slip. Good deal otherwise.
 
Just got off the phone with dave the gear man...he's been chasin' several axle and transfer case bom numbers with his good bud at Dana/spicer all morning.

There are many "bom" numbers that are not in any paper reference, microfiche reference, or online reference. Most especially for IH axle/tc applications due to the fact that IH would "spec" these components for a fleet order of maybe only 10 or 100 vehicle builds, therefore they never made it into what we would today call a dbase.

But...this info is cataloged inna card index and has to be hand-searched (remember the old card file system at the library?) in the Dana/spicer archives so it takes a while for return info.

The only difference inna common IH/d44 bom between a number that appears in the references vs. One that does not appear, May be as simple as adding or removing a slinger from a pinion assembly! Or it could have some kind of specialty yoke included to meet the vehicle end-user's spec. And some IH-spec d44 axles were actually used in off-highway lift truck or tug applications that had nothing to do with IH production other than they might have used an IH six cylinder engine!

So...john's bom of 603731-2 checks out as an open diff Scout II (1976 production) steering axle with 3.54 ratio.

And ron's bom 603427-8 is a '74 Scout II Dana 44 steering axle, open diff, with a 3.31 ratio originally.

So bottom line is...the "online" and "print" Dana/spicer axle references carry only the most common and "normal" production codes, if you have a bom that is not listed, then that does not mean it was never built...it simply means it fell outside the "normal" production spec/ordering/manufacturing range and was a very low production (maybe only one!) assembly!

This was especially true regarding a complete service part axle assembly back in the day...the service part axle carried a completely different bom and IH part number from what would have been installed on the assembly line, even though they are identical. That is still a common practice today for any motor vehicle manufacturer.
 
Michael, u the man, you followed thru with a very through style. I appreciate your efforts. I did finally get my lineticket and it comfirms both axles are original. For what ever its worth.
Ihon is the best!
Thanks
ron

by the way the grill is all warmed up I am just looking for some road kill for when you pass through. :)
 
And feedback such as yours ron really adds to the knowledge base! We always need to know if and how back and forth exchanges such as this turn out in the end, closure (good or not so good!) is just as important as the question!

So once more...by doing things this way...we know what the answer is and it's verified from two sources! Beats tha hail outta usa today and the nyt! We all learn new stuff every time, ain't a single one of us has even close to all the answers! And I'm about as dumm azza bois'darc stump about gear schnizz, thank goodness we got dave on our team now! And even dave has lernt shit from Jeff! And Jeff and Chad and Darren have lernt shit from dave!

Ya know that old saw about bullshit and walkin'....

I'll be bringin' the mother phelpsette down to our place here sometime next week to place it under the spyglass. Dependin' upon what we find, then the new owner back east will make a decision as to how it'll be delivered to him. If I/we do it, I'll come right through yore front yard (just hope it ain't sideways though). I'll keep ya posted!
 
I am getting a plan together on what I am going to do on my 70 800. I have a 76 parts Scout II with Dana 44's power steering and brakes. I am gonna swap the axles to the 800.

My question is will the limited slip currently in the rear of the 800(power loc) 44 go into the front 44 that is currently in the Scout II. The 800 currently has 3.73 and the Scout II has 3.54. After reading this tread I am assuming the Scout II has a trac-loc. I have not verified this. Is it worth the effort if it will fit? If I didnt have the parts already I probably would not spend any money right now on traction other than a rebuild kit.......
 
albuq. Henry said:
I am getting a plan together on what I am going to do on my 70 800. I have a 76 parts Scout II with Dana 44's power steering and brakes. I am gonna swap the axles to the 800.

My question is will the limited slip currently in the rear of the 800(power loc) 44 go into the front 44 that is currently in the Scout II. The 800 currently has 3.73 and the Scout II has 3.54. After reading this tread I am assuming the Scout II has a trac-loc. I have not verified this. Is it worth the effort if it will fit? If I didnt have the parts already I probably would not spend any money right now on traction other than a rebuild kit.......
Click to expand...

If the Powr-Lok carrier that is in your s800 axle is a 19 spline version (count the splines on the end of the axle shaft), then no...it will not work in a Scout II d44 axle assembly. If the carrier is a 30 spline item, then it will work.

3.73 and 3.54 carriers will allow either ring and pinion ratio to be used as they are a common part.

I'd advise an actual physical inspection of these parts, as the '70 Scout 800 was a "transition" for both ihc production and for spicer as they moved from the 19 spline/tapered hub d44 axles to the 30 spline/"flanged" axles. We could play around with attempting to make an I.d. By using the bom numbers on each axle, but nothing beats an actual physical inspection.
 
Thanks for your input michael.

I will go ahead and inspect and see what is there. I feel very confident that the 800 has the stock setup, I have an ra-28. Now on the parts Scout II I have no idea what is there other than seeing the sticker in the glovebox...

This helps in giving me direction, and something to check out while I start getting ready for my project...
 
albuq. Henry said:
thanks for your input michael.

I will go ahead and inspect and see what is there. I feel very confident that the 800 has the stock setup, I have an ra-28. Now on the parts Scout II I have no idea what is there other than seeing the sticker in the glovebox...

This helps in giving me direction, and something to check out while I start getting ready for my project...
Click to expand...

An ra-28/14028 axle shows to be a "pre-1970" powrlok, then the same axle code was transitioned to a traclok differential version. Reading between the lines there...I also "think" that is when the change was affected from the 19 spline to 30 spline carrier/axle shaft setup.

So you are correct, a visual inspection is the only way to truly verify the swap feasibility!
 
This looks like the place to get axle codes deciphered. Working on a 75 Scout II that originally had a 196. Rear axle is 175b08 603 4447 which is a standard Dana 44 w/3.54s. Front is problem. It is a Dana 30. Numbers are 11 22 4b4 : built nov 22,1974. And 603562-7. The -7 is not in the spicer list given for 74 1/2-75 front Scout Dana 30s. The -7 should be a -5 for 3:54s.
It definitely has 3.54s front and back for now - going to 3.90s or 4.10s with lockers fairly soon.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top