CA Emmissions and 79 Scouts

Joe M

Joe M

Member
Hey all-
im just curious as to what the rules are with California emissions.

If a person with a 75 or newer wants to do an engine swap can they?


Im not looking to swap out motors in my rig at the moment but I plan to keep this thing forever (its going to be my 9 month old daughters first car) and I dont see California allowing any changes to emissions laws ever based on trying to get these old sv v8's off the road.

If a newer motor is swapped in would car be registered as the new motor?

I.e.- 79 Scout is now in the dmv files as a 95 camero or 2003 silverado?

I suppose all the engine computer and wiring must have to come with it?

Just curious,

Joe m
 
Unless the rules have changed, it used to be that whatever was "newer" ruled. In other words, if you put an older engine in your '79, you would still be required to keep all of the smog equipment intact that your rig came with. If you put a newer engine in, then whatever smog equipment was required with the year and model of the new engine would have to be installed, ie: o2 sensor, cats, computer, etc. And, you would have to take it to a carb referee to have it inspected and a sticker affixed to the vehicle certifying it, so that you could pass the biannual inspections. It's a heck of a lot easier to buy a 1975 or older vehicle and do whatever you want to it, whenever you want, with no restrictions, no smog checks, etc.
 
Indeed, the emissions and smog crapola is why all my own vehicles are 75 or older. And not limited to the legalities of what I can and can't install in my own junk.

Just my .02 cents on the smog crapola. From my understanding for swapping motors in a smog required vehicle. Is that the new motor needs to be of the same year or newer as the vehicle in question. I.e. - say 77 Scout, a motor out of an 80 Scout can be swapped into the 77. The registration would stay the same for the 77, regardless of which motor is put in. Then again, it's many a very long time since I have had to deal with smog stuff in any of my own rigs. So I could be wrong, if the the rules have changed over the years.
 
You're breaking my heart wendel. :cryin:
me and my '79 are currently doing the test-only two step!

What really torques me off is the fact that we have to pass tighter standards today than when our vehicles were first made.
Grrrrrrrrrr.

Marty
 
From the carb website:

replacement engines
entire engines can be replacement parts. As with any other replacement part, the engine must be identical to the original. If the replacement block or engine is obtained without emissions equipment, all the equipment from the original engine must be installed on the replacement block.
If the engine is not identical to the original then it is not a replacement part, instead it is considered an engine change.
Engine changes are a modification that must meet certain requirements to be legal (please see "engine changes").

Engine changes
engine changes are legal as long as the following requirements are met to ensure that the change does not increase pollution from the vehicle:

the engine must be the same year or newer than the vehicle.

The engine must be from the same type of vehicle (passenger car, light-duty truck, heavy-duty truck, etc.) based on gross vehicle weight.

If the vehicle is a California certified vehicle then the engine must also be a California certified engine.

All emissions control equipment must remain on the installed engine.

After an engine change, vehicles must first be inspected by a state referee station. The vehicle will be inspected to ensure that all the equipment required is in place, and vehicle will be emissions tested subject to the specifications of the installed engine.
 
Thanks for all the info guys. Helps a lot. Along with moose I think its nuts that they do not respect our rigs like we do. Not just anyone can keep one of these things up and running in good enough condition to drive it around daily. Im just looking long term. Hope the 345 stays up to par!

Joe m
 
Sometimes the easiest way is to buy a cheap beater off craigslist or wherever for a few hundred bucks with a title and just swap the license plates and dash and door mounted riveted on vin plate (the license plate is what really matters). Then just cancel the current title with the dmv (like it was junked or totalled in an accident) and renew the new title for the older Scout. Old beater scouts are a dime a dozen, have 0 resale value, and are fairly easy to find. Mine is (was) a 77' and I bought a complete 73' for $400 and got a new title, body, a bunch of good parts, and even sold the remaining chassis (drivetrain minus the body) for the $400 I paid! Keep your eyes open, good deals pop up periodically.
 
Thanks burton,
I thought that might be a good way to go with this. I really want to keep it on the up and up but when it comes to the government I dont think they will ever give us guys with old rigs a break.

Joe
 
I'd be careful following the scenario that burton advocates, as I believe you'd be committing a felony. And don't forget, threre are vin numbers stamped in the frame.
 
When I lived in cali in a previous life the basic rule was same year our newer same size or smaller nothing older nothing bigger. I did a bunch conversion work there the laws in the that slice of paradise proved to be to restrictive had to keep two engines for my mustang 1 to drive and one to put in every two years for smog inspection.
I opened garcias in pleasanton and carlos murphys in san jose and drove through livermore alot I used to live in antioch. Liked the people not damn rules and laws
jim
 
Yeah, nobody, including law enforcement and 99% of the general population knows the difference between a 71' and an 80' Scout 2, and they don't care anyway. They all have the exact same bodies and anyone besides an IH fan aren't going to be looking at the slightly different grilles or the 80' square headlights. If anyone was ever pulled over for any sort of traffic violation, all that matters to the law enforcement for the vehicle is your license plate, current registration and insurance. If your pre-75, the dmv doesn't care about you. If anyone has ever had their vin checked on their pre-75 Scout, whether it be on the door plate, dash, or frame (yeah, right), please let me know cause' I want to hear the story!
 
I bought a 75 Ford f150 4x4 that was sweet moved from cali to oregon went to the mvd they went out to verify my vin cab numbers all is well he layed down his drop cloth crawled under and oops frame didn't match the cab and didn't match the title my nightmare begins ended with a bucket full of money and a junkyard frame and cab with matching title and a lot of work. Its not if you get caught its when. If oregon checks that closely its just a matter of time until other states will. This was at the mvd in roseburg.
 
Most people don't knowingly commit felonies, whether they think they'll be caught or not. Also, you'll need to hope that your rig is never stolen and recovered, as they'll most probably check all numbers before returning it. When the frame numbers don't match the vin tag and title, needless to say, there'll be some explaining to do.
 
That is why I'm going through all the trouble of using the matching frame for the 71's title, that I'm using with the 78's tub. As far as the law is concerned....my sii is completely legal with matching frame and vin. Its pretty easy to find a pre-smog sii to use as a donor for a late model "change-over". The only right way to do it is to use the frame also. A bit more work, but since there are no numbers stamped on the body, I dont consider it illegal. It's really not any different than getting a junkyard 1/2 of body and repairing a modern vehicle.

Although I havent ever been "called" on all the numbers. There is a chance that you will meet someone who will know where to look on our old IH's for matching vin's
 
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