1977 Traveler wont start. Is there a fix all system I can buy?

[WillysLogger]

Hello.
I am a new member. Bought a 1977 traveler last fall for $300. It has a 345, with auto tranny, 4x4. The guy said it hadnt run in 12 years and the tranny was broke. My plan was to cut it down, scrap everything except frame and axles, and put a 1955 willys wagon on it. Out of curiosity, I rebult the carb, poured some fuel in, and it ran. So, I put on a new master cylinder, wheel cylinders, cleaned the tank, poured fluid in the tranny, and tuned it up. It ran flawlessly, with lots of torque, burns no oil, and the engine is as quiet as a new car. Last week, suddenly, it refused to low idle. I shut it off, and now it wont start. I have rebuilt the carb again, new plugs and dizzy cap. Still no start. I did notice before it quit, it would seem to start when I released the key while cranking. I have read many posts on this issue, but nothing seems to work. It has the "gold box". I have 12 volts at coil. So, if nothing works, I guess its going to the choppin' block.
My question: is there a proven kit/system to replace the gold box (for my model)that is reliable? Ie: after market distributer, petronix ignition, etc??
Any info would help.
Thanks.
Willyslogger

 

[Dealbreaker74]

It sounds like your ghost box is living up to its name. There could be some other internal truck wire issues ( the bulkhead connector, mice munching, overall neglect), but having lived this nightmare before, you'd be better off eliminating it. Especially since it sounds like you'll keep the drive train for your future body mod.
There is a pertronix kit that will drop in, and also look up bill hamilton's mods for that distributor. His alternative uses part store items available anywhere. If the pertronix goes paws up, it'll be at least a day to get a replacement.

 

[WillysLogger]

Thanks, dealbreaker.
After two weeks of dead-ends, I replaced the gold box, and still nothing. To make a long story short, after all the time and $$$, it was a defective distributor cap/rotor. As I said, it was hardly running (wouldnt idle) when I parked it. I had just washed it and thought maybe the dizzy cap got some steam in it, so I replaced it. It wouldnt start. So, on to all the other items, plugs, carb, etc. When it wouldnt start after replacing the gold box, I put the old dizzy cap and rotor back on, and boom, it fired right up! I think o'reily's is going to get an earfull.
I still would like to know what people here think is the best ignition system replacement for the old gold box equipped scouts.
Thanks, again.
Wl

 

[1975IH200]

Congrats on the successful troubleshooting and repair.

You should now know a lot more about the ignition system of your IH now than you did before.

The Holley gold box electronic system that you have is not a bad system, but it isn't a great system either. It is an early automotive electronic ignition system whose time has passed it by.

option #1: the pertronix system, in my opinion, is only one step better.

option #2:as mentioned, bill hamilton's solutions to this is using easily available off-the shelf parts to install a more modern and dependable system into the current distributor housing. The parts are readily available and fairly cheap. If you like to do-it-yourself, and can afford to have your IH down for a day or two, then this is one of the best ways to go (cheapest).

option #3: another solution, albeit more expensive, is the dui system that is sold at IHPartsAmerica. It is almost a drop-in mod, using only one 12v+ wire, and solves the ignition issue you will continue to have with the Holley gb.

I have the dui in my truck and like it very much. Very dependable, more ignition voltage, replacement parts available at any parts store, and the distributor is self-contained with the coil in the dizzy cap like the GM hei system from the 80's & 90's. It utilizes the GM hei cap & rotor, coil and ignition module.

Here are a few pics of my dui dizzy installation.......and the old Holley gb system that I removed.

 

[Dealbreaker74]

So help us understand exactly what fixed it...
You changed over to pertronix and still had no love? And then replaced cap and rotor? And now all is good? If that's the case, then that cap and rotor was in some batch-ass condition. Ive actually started my truck after forgetting to latch the cap back down. It was at least an inch out of position and it still (sort of) ran...
Part of the problem solving is based on the assumption that all of the obvious stuff is up to snuff. Maybe I assumed too much here.
The plugs, wires, cap and rotor are all consumable items. The wires not so much, but plugs can get crusty-oily in these motors, and obviously the cap and rotor wont last forever, so until all of this stuff is known to be good (same with fuel filter, good carb, etc), its tough to tech a hard start/no start problem. Glad you got it going.

By far the best bang for the buck mod you can do for one of these old lumps is improve the ignition. Forget cam, headers, carbs, whatever. Its ignition. Plenty of people will back me up on this. I spent years languishing with the ghost box system. In the days when you could still find ihs in the junk yards, I would grab them whenever I could find them and keep as spares. Then finally pertronix came out and I modified it to work with my Holley distributor.
At the same time, I installed a jacobs mileagemaster ignition box. I obtained it in trade, so I thought why not? Its like an msd box. Multiple high energy sparks at revs below about 3000. All I can say is, this system made a huge difference over the ghost box. Even alone, the pertronix was sooo much better. The butt dyno agreed there was more power, better drive-ability, no hesitation, better cold-starts, blah blah blah. It was amazing the difference it made.
Since then, I have discovered the internet, and this site. Bill hamilton is my new hero. His junk yard style suits me well, and had I known then what I know now, I would have done a duraspark mod instead of the pertronix, if only to save some bucks. Plus, it uses bits that can be obtained at any parts store if something dies.
Bottom line, you'll be super happy with the pertronix. The latest stuff just drops in and works very well. I have never had an issue with mine.
As far as the dui system goes, I only know what I have read. It is pretty spendy and bulky. You've got to land it just right so the vac canister doesn't smack anything as you get it timed. Other people have them and love them, but for me, the options above suit me better.

Best of luck with that willys changeover. I'd like to see that as it happens.

Edit:
I just re-read the post. You went with another ghost box....my condolences....
But everything above still holds true when this one lets you down!
Good luck

 

[WillysLogger]

I havent gone to a pertronix system. The problem was the new distributer cap I put on it was defective. I only found this out after replacing everything else I mentioned in a effort to get it to start. It runs now, but still wont low idle. I would like to look into bill hamilton's system.
Thanks so much for the support. I am really starting to like this site!

P.s. : can I expect any gains in fuel mileage if I convert to the hamilton FI?