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Old 01-03-2010, 08:56 AM   #16
Scoutboy74
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

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Originally Posted by michael mayben View Post
one more time for summa you short bus riders/slow learners/fat white boyz and jerry,...here's the butched connector with terminal id along side a replacement pigtail.

These terminal designations never change!!
Hey! Yer insultin' short bus riderz!
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Last edited by Michael Mayben; 01-03-2010 at 09:19 AM..
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Old 01-03-2010, 09:12 AM   #17
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

Here's the completed harness we've fabbed, installed on the sample 10si and dressed with split-loom.

All that is left is to route it in the engine bay in a neat fashion, secure with zip-ties or adel clamps, and connect the loose ends.

As far as where to connect the red 8 gauge "bat" wire...that will vary for your particular application.

One method is simply install it at the same terminal where the original output wire was connected. (such as the oem starter solenoid bat lug).

If you have installed the remote starter relay upgrade, the output wire can terminate right at the lug which is connected to the positive terminal on the battery itself. Remember, this is the wire that carries regulated charging current to the battery when the engine is running and spinning the alternator. That is how them lectrons git packed back into the battery when ya pull 'em out to run the ignition system, the lights, the radio, etc!

That's it! If yore real luckee and hold yore mouth just right, tha dam thang will make juice when ya crank it up!

When you turn the ignition switch to "on", the idiot light should illuminate brightly. Once the engine fires off and settles into an idle, the idiot light will go out...indicating a charging condition is taking place (as long as the alternator and battery and cabling is good!). If engine/alternator rpm drops too low, the idiot light May begin to glow faintly, indicating a "no charge" condition due to reduced output due to alternator rotational speed....once engine rpm is increased, the light will again extinguish.

One condition which ya might find regarding some remanned 10si alternators...if they used a really shitty quality el cheepo solid-state voltage regulator, the alternator might be somewhat reluctant to "turn on" after a cold start, if ya see that...boot the throttle a time or two to increase rotational speed and make the bitch pump, once it comes to life, the idiot light should extinguish and stay off unless engine rpm drops way below normal idle speed. If it does not, or the idiot light repeatedly turns off at idle, then take the pos reman back and git a good one!
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Old 01-03-2010, 09:20 AM   #18
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

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Originally Posted by scoutboy74 View Post
hey! Yer insultin' short bus riderz!
Yeah...but that morphine yore downin' will dam shore cure yore "short bus syndrome"! But don't let jerry near that morphine shit, otherwise he might expire all too soon!
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Old 01-18-2010, 11:17 AM   #19
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

Mm
enjoy your write up, have done two or three on all my tractors and will do one on my loadstar in the near future. However, have a question. In yuor last photo you show a "t" connector that the flex conduit attach too. Have never seen one. Can they be obtained from the local auto parts stores or are they a special order item.
A unrelated question. In one of your other post, you mentioned/used a gel cleaner for cleaning a engine? And a transmission. I thought it was a wisner product but can not seem to find the thread. Have soom real crud to clean off and need all the help I can get. Thanks in advance

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Old 01-18-2010, 02:13 PM   #20
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

Jerry!

Those "tee" and end finisher fittings for the split loom tubing are normally found where the tubing is hanging in those blister packs on the wall at the parts house, they come in singles, 5-paks, etc. The stuff I find/use most often around here is packaged by pico:

pico automotive wire trailer adapters plugs connector kits

That should be a pico catalog that shows the stuff under "convoluted wire coverings".

Also I use stuff from these folks who are a local wholesaler (for us in oregon) and we find their stuff in the retail stores that don't carry pico:

noble wire & terminal corp. - the complete wholesale line of* terminals, wire and wiring devices,* nationwide

That gel-type citrus base degreaser is a winzer product:

winzer corporation

Contact them directly and they will put you in touch with a winzer distributor in your area. I still think the stuff is the best I've ever used!
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Old 01-20-2010, 08:28 PM   #21
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

When reclocking a 10si, is there anything to be careful of?

I will be converting the red wagon as I have an alternator bracket in the garage reserved for it. I have not inspected it closely yet to check on the "quality" of the holes, but at least I have the bracket.

Also, I plan on converting the rambleall to a delco and get rid of the motorola and it's external regulator. I've been in trouble with that one once already.

Great writeup!! Thanks Mike.

Lyle
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Old 01-20-2010, 11:53 PM   #22
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

No, imo...

Remove the 4 bolts connecting the two halves, and

use a large screwdriver and very gently pry at each of the bolt hole "tabs" (4) until you can separate the two halves about 1/8".

Then, you should be able to rotate the "back half" (non-pulley) to the correct position. Replace the 4 bolts and you are good to go.

You do not want to separate the two halves very much because you could end up with the brushes (at the "back" of the altenator) losing contact with "rotor"... Since they are "spring-loaded", you could end up "chasing" / "looking for" the springs.

If that happens, you need need to take the alt apart; find the spinrgs; put a spring back in the slot and put a brush back in on top of the spring and press it down until you can insert a toothpick thru the rear of the case thru the hole in the brushholder used for that purpose (if purchase a new brushholder, it comes with "toothpicks" to hold the brushes in place until the alt is assembled.). Repeat for the other brush pushing the toothpick further in.

If the brushes are worn, you should put the brushe back in the holder in the correct orientation if necessary -- so that they make full contact with the rotor. New brushes are flat, but they wear down "1/2 round" as they rub against the round surface of the rotor.

Attached is a photo of a new 10si brushholder with brushes:
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Last edited by RobertC; 01-21-2010 at 09:18 AM..
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:25 AM   #23
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

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Originally Posted by robertc View Post
no, imo...

Remove the 4 bolts connecting the two halves, and

use a large screwdriver and very gently pry at each of the bolt hole "tabs" (4) until you can separate the two halves about 1/8".

Then, you should be able to rotate the "back half" (non-pulley) to the correct position. Replace the 4 bolts and you are good to go.

You do not want to separate the two halves very much because you could end up with the brushes (at the "back" of the altenator) losing contact with "rotor"... Since they are "spring-loaded", you could end up "chasing" / "looking for" the springs.

If that happens, you need need to take the alt apart; find the spinrgs; put a spring back in the slot and put a brush back in on top of the spring and press it down until you can insert a toothpick thru the rear of the case thru the hole in the brushholder used for that purpose (if purchase a new brushholder, it comes with "toothpicks" to hold the brushes in place until the alt is assembled.). Repeat for the other brush pushing the toothpick further in.

If the brushes are worn, you should put the brushe back in the holder in the correct orientation if necessary -- so that they make full contact with the rotor. New brushes are flat, but they wear down "1/2 round" as they rub against the round surface of the rotor.

Attached is a photo of a new 10si brushholder with brushes:
Yep!
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Old 01-21-2010, 09:48 AM   #24
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

Quote:
Originally Posted by lyle wiese View Post
when reclocking a 10si, is there anything to be careful of?

I will be converting the red wagon as I have an alternator bracket in the garage reserved for it. I have not inspected it closely yet to check on the "quality" of the holes, but at least I have the bracket.

Also, I plan on converting the rambleall to a delco and get rid of the motorola and it's external regulator. I've been in trouble with that one once already.

Great writeup!! Thanks Mike.

Lyle
Since ya got access to a major machine shop lyle, if your alternator bracket is wallered out, you could jig it in the mill to straighten the hole for alignment purposes very easily. Then either push in a split bushing to restore the hole to 3/8" pivot bolt size, or machine out the mount boss on the 10si to the larger size. These cast mounts are one more item we need to preserve at all costs, just like water pump housings!

As for the motorola, I hear ya about that! Those were difficult to deal with and expensive back in the day when encountered on any vehicle they were found on! And still are as you know! Kinda like the hitachi stuff on the sii diesel setup.

I've not paid any attention to the driven pulley on your motorola, is it about the same diameter as the 10si stuff we mess with?? I'm not familiar at all with the drive characteristics of the motorola system and what the "breakover" point (engine rpm) is for alternator output at typical idle speed.
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Old 01-21-2010, 07:40 PM   #25
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

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Originally Posted by michael mayben View Post
since ya got access to a major machine shop lyle, if your alternator bracket is wallered out, you could jig it in the mill to straighten the hole for alignment purposes very easily. Then either push in a split bushing to restore the hole to 3/8" pivot bolt size, or machine out the mount boss on the 10si to the larger size. These cast mounts are one more item we need to preserve at all costs, just like water pump housings!

As for the motorola, I hear ya about that! Those were difficult to deal with and expensive back in the day when encountered on any vehicle they were found on! And still are as you know! Kinda like the hitachi stuff on the sii diesel setup.

I've not paid any attention to the driven pulley on your motorola, is it about the same diameter as the 10si stuff we mess with?? I'm not familiar at all with the drive characteristics of the motorola system and what the "breakover" point (engine rpm) is for alternator output at typical idle speed.
Yes, it's nice to work in a complete machine shop. Fortunately, the boss allows "government work" with prior permission.

Motorolas are hard to find when you need one. When mine took a dump in hood river there were none to be found on either side of the river. Finally just recharged the battery from another rig on the cruise and headed home. To my surprise autozoo had one.

The pulley on the motorola is a formed one, 2.88" od.

I'll check the "breakover point" the next time I move it out of the garage. I suspect it about ready to take a dump again. Sometime it charges just fine at idle; sometimes I need to kick the throttle and sometimes it stays in "d" either way or maybe the idle rpm is right at the "breakover point" and I just need to speed it up slightly. I'll let you know what I find out.

Lyle
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Old 07-17-2010, 07:09 PM   #26
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

I've seen references to an external diode with the 10si/12si. Any idea what that's about?
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Old 07-17-2010, 08:16 PM   #27
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

The external stuff is to raise the amperage of alternator. Absolutly not necessary. Years back it was. But now you van get a high amp alt for pretty cheap.
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Old 07-17-2010, 08:21 PM   #28
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

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Originally Posted by mastiff View Post
I've seen references to an external diode with the 10si/12si. Any idea what that's about?
Some people use the diode instead of a resistor or idiot light in the alternator's "turn on" circuit.

If there isn't some sort of device to limit the current on that circuit the voltage regulator in the alt will fry.
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Old 07-18-2010, 02:53 AM   #29
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

Eric is correct. I was thinking rectifier.
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Old 07-19-2010, 02:46 PM   #30
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Default Re: The Delcotron 10si Alternator Thread

The add-on diode has nothing to do with tickling/exciting the field on a 10si to initiate charging (used instead of the "resistor wire"). It's used with add-on cd ignition boxes such as supplied by mallory, accel, jacobs, msd, crane, etc. In order to prevent backfeed to the ignition circuit so that the ignition switch will positively kill the ignition when turned off. Otherwise the ignition system can be turned "on", but can't be turned "off". This is a totally different situation and has only to do with the addition of the aftermarket cd unit for ignition. It can occur with any alternator which uses internal regulation.

The "output" of any alternator is determined by the amount of "copper" in it's coil windings and the technology involved in it's construction (either delta-wound or wye-wound), and the ampacity of the rectifier and regulator component.
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