IH PARTS AMERICA
Click Here!

Go Back   IH PARTS AMERICA > Tech Forums > Suspension Tech
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read Photo Gallery IH Store Home

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 10-02-2017, 06:13 AM   #1
Rollercam
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Member Number: 8656
Posts: 4
Default Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

First off, please forgive my ignorance regarding 4 wheel drive suspensions (I have more of a muscle car background). I have a 78 Scout II 4x4. I had a reputable off road shop check the scout over and they said it looked good and had not been chopped up. The only suspension change that had been performed was the addition of a rough country 4" lift in 2015 by the previous owner. This lift is where my concern lies. I have read nothing but bad reviews regarding the rough country springs due to there stiff ride. I honestly have nothing to compare the ride quality to, but it seems rough. I don't expect a leaf spring lifted 1978 Scout to ride like my 2011 Z71, but it does seem overly stiff to me.

Right or wrong, I did swap out the rough country shocks for some skyjacker monotube M-95 shocks that I was able to purchase at a very good price. These are supposedly their best shock. I would like to know if you have any suggestions for further improving the on-road ride quality. This scout will spend 90% of its time on paved roads and 10% of its time driving around fairly flat unpaved terrain. So, handling, steering, and safety characteristics are important to me. I would prefer to retain the 4" lift springs that I have for cost purposes, looks, and because of the 33" inch tires I already have on the scout, but I am willing to even consider different springs if absolutely necessary. Would reverse shackling help? I am really not even sure of the purpose of reverse shackling. Would better shocks help? If so, what do you suggest? Do I need longer shackles?
Etc? Any help in getting a more predictable, comfortable, and controllable ride would be greatly appreciated.

Last edited by Rollercam; 10-02-2017 at 06:56 AM..
Rollercam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2017, 08:30 AM   #2
FDChappie
Senior Member
 
FDChappie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Member Number: 3742
Location: Northern New California
Posts: 1,556
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

Don't know about the Rough country springs, but the Rancho springs 4" springs on my Scout were known to be the stiffest. I changed to the Bilstein shocks available here a couple of years ago and they made a huge difference. Another very good option is to do a reverse shackle setup for the front springs.

One upside for stiff springs is that they will reduce body roll on the corners.
__________________
1974 Scout II 345 T-19
1971 Travelette 392 T-36
1972 Loadstar 1700 dump truck 345 T-35
FDChappie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2017, 10:52 AM   #3
ihpartsjeff
Administrator & Owner
 
ihpartsjeff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Member Number: 1
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Age: 44
Posts: 4,105
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

Reverse shackle will help but it will still be a stiff ride. Bilstein shocks will probably help as well but still be stiff compared to say Skyjacker Softrides. The Rough Country 2.5" springs ride a lot better. For budget reasons, since the Rough Country springs are half the cost of Skyjackers, you could swap to those instead and add in a small body lift to make up the difference.
__________________

Jeff Ismail
IH Parts America - Owner
IH Sierra Fall Rallye Event Coordinator
CPT - Crawler Proven Technology
(530)274-1795
ihpartsjeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2017, 04:57 PM   #4
Rollercam
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Member Number: 8656
Posts: 4
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

First off, thank you for the responses. Just to clarify, if I was willing to spend a little, my number 1 option would be to just go ahead and replace my 4" rough country springs with 4" skyjacker soft ride springs? Would I still want to get the Bilsteins or would my skyjacker M-95 monotubes be okay for now? I believe skyjacker just sells the springs by themselves, but I am not sure if rough country sells their springs alone without having to purchase the kit.

If the skyjacker springs are not in the budget, and I get some 2.5" rough country springs (for a less jarring ride), could I do an extended shackle (say 5") alone or in combination with a small body lift along with the 2.5" springs to bring me back close to my current 4" lift? I am assuming that if I just did the 2.5" RC springs and nothing else, then I may not have enough clearance for my 33" tires. Is this correct or will they still clear without any rubbing or turning issues?
Rollercam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-03-2017, 05:59 AM   #5
ihpartsjeff
Administrator & Owner
 
ihpartsjeff's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Member Number: 1
Location: Grass Valley, CA
Age: 44
Posts: 4,105
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rollercam View Post
First off, thank you for the responses. Just to clarify, if I was willing to spend a little, my number 1 option would be to just go ahead and replace my 4" rough country springs with 4" skyjacker soft ride springs? Would I still want to get the Bilsteins or would my skyjacker M-95 monotubes be okay for now? I believe skyjacker just sells the springs by themselves, but I am not sure if rough country sells their springs alone without having to purchase the kit.

If the skyjacker springs are not in the budget, and I get some 2.5" rough country springs (for a less jarring ride), could I do an extended shackle (say 5") alone or in combination with a small body lift along with the 2.5" springs to bring me back close to my current 4" lift? I am assuming that if I just did the 2.5" RC springs and nothing else, then I may not have enough clearance for my 33" tires. Is this correct or will they still clear without any rubbing or turning issues?
You could swap springs and keep your current shocks. They are not terrible by any means but not a Bilstein either. If you do want to swap out leafsprings we do sell them individually, both Skyjacker and Rough Country. They are not listed online individually so would have to call in to get current pricing. Regardless of what spring you go with I would add the extended shackles that we offer as they too will slightly help with the ride quality by freeing up the spring travel. If after swapping out to say Rough Country 2.5" springs with the extended shackles and you still don't have enough lift for your 33" tires you could then add a small body lift. regardless you're still going to get a lot of ride quality improvement with one of our CPT reverse shackle kits.
__________________

Jeff Ismail
IH Parts America - Owner
IH Sierra Fall Rallye Event Coordinator
CPT - Crawler Proven Technology
(530)274-1795
ihpartsjeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2018, 12:15 PM   #6
Rollercam
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2017
Member Number: 8656
Posts: 4
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

Sorry to bump an old thread, but I have a few more questions regarding my suspension set-up.

As the scout sits today, it has 4” rough country lift springs and skyjacker M95 monotube shocks. Everything else is factory or stock replacement.

The scout is currently in a local shop getting some electrical work and general tuning ironed out. The guy working on it said with the 4” lift he is concerned about the pinion angle of the front driveshaft. He wants to add some shims to try and straighten it out a bit. My concern is that if he tries to alter the pinion angle with shims then it will give me more negative caster. Am I thinking correctly? He does not seem that concerned about the caster, but I want drivability and safety.

I would really like to keep my 4” lift. Even though they are notoriously stiff, I would also like to just go ahead and keep my rough country springs to avoid having to buy new springs. Could I possibly get some bilstein or fox shocks to dampen the ride better? They could always be revalved later if something changes.

So, here is what I am thinking right now:

4” rough country springs (I already have them on the scout and they have very few miles on them)
Bilstein or Fox 2.0 shocks
Reverse shackle kit for front end
5” shackle for the back (I am hoping this will level out the truck after adding some height with the reverse shackle)
Cut and Turn in front (I don’t see anyway around doing this and it just seem like a good thing to do)
Longer front driveshaft

Anything else? How does that sound? Is there a more cost effective way to maintain a 4”-5” lift and have a secure and stable ride? If so, please let me know. I am not against going SOA, but I am not sure if that is cost effective. This truck will spend 90% of its life on the road.
Rollercam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-07-2018, 05:32 PM   #7
Hondo
Senior Member
 
Hondo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Member Number: 4714
Location: Fremont
Posts: 446
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

Spring over by itself will give about a 3" lift - at least the thickness of your axle tubes, so you would probably want the 2.5" or stock springs. The longer shackles usually require caster shims to get the pinion angles back to where they were before tilting the axles with longer shackles on only one end of the springs . The 2 1/2" lift inch springs, a slight body lift, longer shackles, extended bump stops, and the cut and turn are probably the way you want to go. Don't know how beefy the side walls on your 33s are, but running lower pressure in them will also help a little with the ride quality. Probably get by with 25 -28 psi on the street as long as you don't try to road race with it. FYI I have the 4" Skyjackers with 5" shackles and 33 X 10.5 Grabber X3s. The rear tires still hit in the back when flexed fairly hard.
__________________
1975 Scout II healthy 258, Wide T19 , 4:1 D300 3:54s,
1972 Real clean stock Scout II P/S, P/B, 345, T18, 3:73s
1969 Mach I. Balanced ported 351W, 650 double pumper, Super T10, Detroit locker with 4.11s. Lowered with racing springs, bars, Konis etc.
(Don't worry about getting arrested when I drive the Scouts).
Hondo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-08-2018, 07:32 AM   #8
Scoutboy74
Moderator
 
Scoutboy74's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Member Number: 453
Location: Daze Crick, Jefferson
Posts: 3,888
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

From what I've seen and read concerning the SOA conversion, is that it generally nets more than 5" of lift with the stock springs.
In my own observation, when it comes to the Rough Country product, is that there isn't that much difference in lift between the 2.5" and the 4" lift springs. I wouldn't want to live on the difference. I have RC 4" springs on my Scout and I swear that other Scouts I've seen with RC 2.5 springs have perhaps just a fuzz less lift than mine does.
__________________
Favorite hobby...Driving Salma Hayek in my Scout

Coal Trickle - '99 Dodge Ram 2500 Q-Cab SWB 4x4 - 5.9L 24V CTD/NV4500
Hooty - '74 SII - 392/TF727/D20/3.73 D44's/Spartan FA/Krac-lok RA/RC 4" SUA/34x10.5 TSLs/33g Fuel/HFT 8k winch
Mongo - '71 1210 Std Cab 2WD - 345/TF727/RA17 D60 4.10 Trac-lok - "Mongo love candy! Duh, huh, huh!"
Scoutboy74 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-09-2018, 04:00 AM   #9
Scooter
Senior Member
 
Scooter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Member Number: 917
Location: Richmond, CA
Posts: 1,718
Default Re: Ride Quality with Rough Country 4" Lift

I personally have done A SOA conversion on my own scout A few years ago. Gained roughly 5-1/2" lift. That was with the oem leaf springs that were already on the scout at the time.
I recommend doing the shackle reversal kit install on the front end. I have installed about 5 kits. A couple on my own and a few others for friends. My personal opinion, that reversal kit made a big improvement in highway manners.

Scout front axles basically come with 0* caster. If that shop wants to add degree shims to help pinion angle on the front axle, ride quality might go from bad to worse. One thing to help with that, often talked about, is doing what's called a cut-n-turn on the front axle. Basically it involves grinding off the weld holding the C's to the axle tube, then rotating the C's to gain a positive caster. I have read between 4 to 6 degree positive caster
__________________
The fleet
73 Scout II - 73 Beast SOA, Shackle Reversal. Several things being re-worked through out.
72 Scout II - Ole Yeller - Finally rolling around town.
74 Scout II - Barrel Rolled - Rest in peace
72 Scout II = SOLD
51 Studebaker pickup - A non running project. Slowly in the works
Scooter is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 08:45 PM.