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Old 02-20-2010, 04:07 PM   #1
Josh Shoemaker
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Exclamation Almost 49 years ago. Corrected.

Was when this Scout 80 rolled out the door and into someones possession. Where I am sure they enjoyed it and over the years previous owners had it where to them it was just another vehicle and the love they had for it turned into abuse.
Edit: thanks for pointing that out Robert. I would hate to deprive her of the time she has spent here.

3 years ago to the month it happen to come in my possession where I became a owner of my first Scout. Though it stayed in the back yard waiting for some glimmer of affection. I tried to absorb as much information about it as I could get my hands on.

Well today is the day it gets a taste of the love that it has been loneing for so many years now. As I have reached the level that gave me the direction that I want to head in now. I have a plan in my head that I want to execute to get this beatiful Scout back on the road and have some adventures with.

This is my first project ever trying to bring a vehicle back to life. I have never attempted anything like this before and promise to stay with it until it is completely 100% road worthy. I can truthfully say that this will be a long and drawed out process as I am taking my time with it and am a firm believer in doing it right the first time. I will also add that this thread will have plenty of pictures in it. A documentary so to speak so that maybe this thread could be a tool to use and someone can learn from my mistakes.

I purchased the line set tickets so that I could see what she had (or supposed to have) and what we got now. With the help of michael I was able to decipher the codes. You can refer to this thread for deciphering the codes.

http://www.forums.IHPartsAmerica.com...t-tickets.html




Now that we have a base established we can start the project. The Scout 80, I picked up for $500.00 just the way you see it here.







The plan is to get this old iron back running then access what needs to be done from there. The first thing was the fuel system; figuring that 40 years of gas and temperature changes would have taken its toll on the the tank and the carb. That is where we will start.

Though I didn't take any pictures of the carb when I removed it from the engine; all one has to do is just imagine what was in the fuel bowl. (didn't have a fuel filter nowhere!). I tore it completely down and let soak in napa carb cleaner (my personal favorite). I purchase a rebuild kit from napa due to other parts stores are completely lost when it comes to these. I began to put the carb back together when I noticed that something was missing. Well the internet is your best friend I googled 1904 Holley and found this website. Posted up what I had and found that the carb is not an IH version carb. (typical from what I can tell) and the economizer poppet vavle on mine is missing. Was able to get the information that I needed to get another one (need to get it). And the fuel inlet boss is cracked, and the fuel bowl is warped. Michael is a whiz when it comes to those carbs. You can follow my post of the carb here.
http://www.forums.IHPartsAmerica.com...04-Holley.html

A few pictures of the carb


Stripped threads.

Missing poppet vavle on the economizer

Cracked fuel inlet boss

And warped fuel bowl


I don't have any pictures of the tank but I will tell you that I pour out about 3.5 gallons of water. So I will be looking to replace it. Along with the fuel lines which are full of rust and god knows what else. My plan is to replace the tank with a poly tank and I have found a place here local that sells stainless steel tubing (they have it in stock). So I will be running new fuel lines in stainless and installing a filter somewhere.

More to come!
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Last edited by Josh Shoemaker; 02-22-2010 at 07:27 PM..
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Old 02-20-2010, 04:47 PM   #2
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Since today was a really nice day (in the mid 60's). I wanted to get to work on the project. One of my personal pet peves is to work on a car that is dirty, fithly, greasy, or muddy. Now I know what you are about to say. Spare me the all the comments I have heard them before. But before I do anything I clean!!! Some people call me crazy but when the engine and undercarrage is clean I get motivated. The forty previous years of mud, grease, oil, and lack of care really show itself here.

Being that I work in the hvac field; I know about some chemicals that can really get the job done. I looked at the engine and under the hood and get really discourage from working on it. So out came the coil cleaner, I sprayed the it down and just kept spraying to cut through all that grim. Then I hosed it down. Now it didn't come clean to my standards but it was clean enough to bear with.

Since the cooling system is just as important as the fuel system; I need to get the radiator and heater cores removed. So out came the radiator, four bolts and two hoses. Now can you guess which was the hardest to removed? Nope!! It was the hoses I couldn't get those to budge. I wound up taking a dremel tool and cutting the clamps and hoses to get them off.
Worked great. The bolts came right off, no complaining at all.

I don't know what IH was thinking when they came up with the bolts needed for mounting this heater core. But I think they over done it. Personally I think 3 bolts is suffiencent enough but they thought 5 would be enough. The radiator only had 4. They are not the easiest to remove by yourself. But I got them removed and got it out of there.

Now I know that this Scout had to run hot. I think someone held this radiator beside the discharge of a lawnmower while someone cut the grass. I could not believe all the crap that came out of this radiator. I could not see thur it before I cleaned it. I flushed it out and rusty water just poured out. Now when I removed it from the Scout it still had antifreeze in the bottom of it. So at least I know that the engine should be good against freezing. (this thing has been sitting for 13 years).

When I removed the heater core; I removed the entire assembly fan and all. Well I guess that somewhere I mouse decided that it would make a good home. I removed the core from the housing and cleaned it along with the radiator I got it cleaned really well. Now one thing that I noticed after I got the both of them cleaned; is they don't make them like this anymore. The radiator is a copper core with brass headers and the heater core is brass with copper tubes I think. The shit you get nowadays is aluminum and plastic.


On with the pictures...


The engine compartment
before cleaning.





After cleaning (still not done)


Still got a lot of grim on that steering box









Getting that radiator cleaned

Cleaned now its off to the radiator shop to have it boiled and pressure tested.

Copper tubes and fins with brass headers. Won't see anything like that on todays cars or trucks. Still some black paint on the fins.
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Old 02-20-2010, 05:04 PM   #3
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

After I got the radiator cleaned I noticed that the inlet had a crack on the solder connection. So I am hoping that the shop can repair it.



Got that tag cleaned up nice and pretty.



I would like to get this plug removed. I tried to move it but didn't want to get to aggresive with it. So I shot some kroil on it and will leave over night. I think I have a stainless steel plug that I can use.



Now the hose that was feeding the heater core I believe was the original. It was soft and buglde out. I also believe that the valve to close off the water to the core is operational. It operates very smooth.

That dremel tool works very well when removing those 40 year old clamps.

The rats nest


Cleaned, looks good. Its off with radiator to be boiled and tested.


I noticed this number on the core, does anybody know what it might stand for???


And the vavle





More to follow....
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Old 02-20-2010, 07:28 PM   #4
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Great work for a few days! I can tell you are really motivated!

I went through a near-identical process with our s80 going back about four years ago (maybe five now??). The build was in progress on the "old" binder bulletin ne planet. Wish I'd captured all the text from that one and still had it, I do have the pics.

I fully agree with getting this shit as clean as possible before working on it! I spent days douching mine before I'd allow it in the shop! It had been living inside a huge blackberry garage for fourteen years, that did preserve it from rotting way though, our blackberry here is like yore kudzu...except our blackberry tastes good and we both eat it and drink it!

Those radiators and heater cores are easily repaired by old time radiator folks, I've brought several of 'em back to life and have two fairly fresh ones on hand now (the larger size). The radiator I'm running now looked far worse than yours when I got it, it's now pristine after I hand picked and combed the fins! You being an hvac dude know what I mean about that! And a radiator man can set a fresh bung for the draincock into the lower tank if needed.

All IH radiators for light line vehicles were copper/brass through the end of Scout II production in 1980.

If you do hvac service work, you know as much about soldering this stuff as anyone! Get it clean before making solder melt!!! I'm a self-taught radiator guy who has scruud up a few in the learning process. But good ol' fresh acid paste flux and real 50/50 solder (not this freekin' worthless environmentally-friendly shit), combined with a propane torch will handle that really ez!

I've learned in 40+ years of doing resto-type work, ya don't waste time in trying to remove rotten fasteners when ya can make 'em go away with a giz wheel, torch, or shear! It's much easier to drill out rotten bolts and re-thread than waste time and end up twistin' 'em off anyway! If ya try and pull the door hinges and fenders, you will see what I mean real quick. Torch the heads off and deal with re-thread when the stuff is easy to get to!

Keep goin', ya ain't even started yet!
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Old 02-22-2010, 06:50 PM   #5
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by michael mayben View Post
great work for a few days! I can tell you are really motivated!

I went through a near-identical process with our s80 going back about four years ago (maybe five now??). The build was in progress on the "old" binder bulletin ne planet. Wish I'd captured all the text from that one and still had it, I do have the pics.

I fully agree with getting this shit as clean as possible before working on it! I spent days douching mine before I'd allow it in the shop! It had been living inside a huge blackberry garage for fourteen years, that did preserve it from rotting way though, our blackberry here is like yore kudzu...except our blackberry tastes good and we both eat it and drink it!

Those radiators and heater cores are easily repaired by old time radiator folks, I've brought several of 'em back to life and have two fairly fresh ones on hand now (the larger size). The radiator I'm running now looked far worse than yours when I got it, it's now pristine after I hand picked and combed the fins! You being an hvac dude know what I mean about that! And a radiator man can set a fresh bung for the draincock into the lower tank if needed.

All IH radiators for light line vehicles were copper/brass through the end of Scout II production in 1980.

If you do hvac service work, you know as much about soldering this stuff as anyone! Get it clean before making solder melt!!! I'm a self-taught radiator guy who has scruud up a few in the learning process. But good ol' fresh acid paste flux and real 50/50 solder (not this freekin' worthless environmentally-friendly shit), combined with a propane torch will handle that really ez!

I've learned in 40+ years of doing resto-type work, ya don't waste time in trying to remove rotten fasteners when ya can make 'em go away with a giz wheel, torch, or shear! It's much easier to drill out rotten bolts and re-thread than waste time and end up twistin' 'em off anyway! If ya try and pull the door hinges and fenders, you will see what I mean real quick. Torch the heads off and deal with re-thread when the stuff is easy to get to!

Keep goin', ya ain't even started yet!
Yes I am, it has been a long wait, and I thought about doing it myself but since this is a radiator that is hard to find I thought about one of those guys that wears overalls, has a head of white hair, wears a dirty baseball cap with his companys' name on it, and either smokes or chews would be better at repairing it than I would.

I would have cleaned it alot better than that but my pressure washer died on me. I think I made the mistake of leaving it outside with water in it. The past couple of months had a few below freezing days.

But yeah I have got those fins as straight as I can get them now. I still have alot of oxidation on some of the fins. I thinking about getting some ruby fluid and soaking it in that. I know that will remove all the pertina. Will have to post some pics tomorrow. Camera battery is charging.
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Old 02-22-2010, 07:05 PM   #6
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Hey josh,

old betty is almost 50!!! 2010-1961 = 49.

Very happy to see a early 80 get her time in the sun. I had a 61 sn fc7168 and I had it almost restored when my 65' came along so I sold it (61) to a buddy who I am helping finish it.

I will be watching your progress
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Old 02-23-2010, 07:55 AM   #7
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert kenney View Post
hey josh,

old betty is almost 50!!! 2010-1961 = 49.

Very happy to see a early 80 get her time in the sun. I had a 61 sn fc7168 and I had it almost restored when my 65' came along so I sold it (61) to a buddy who I am helping finish it.

I will be watching your progress
Thanks for pointing that out. I will contribute my lack of math skills to my goverment education.
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Old 02-23-2010, 03:35 PM   #8
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Got the pictures of the straighten out fins.

Before.




After



Even got the ones on the side.





Before



After



Also cleaned the heater vavle






I just amazed at the things you find after you have peeled away the years of rust.

On & off

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Old 02-25-2010, 02:07 PM   #9
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Well got some good news and some bad news today.

The radiator shop called me today and said that the radiator is rotted. It has pin holes in most of the tubes. He had two options.

1. They could recore the that radiator for about $349.
2. They sell me a new one for around $320.

I have another 80 that when ever al gore goes to washington and admits he's wrong about global warming. It will stop snowing in maryland so I can go get it. So I am not too worried about that.

The good news is that the heater core is ok and can be reused.
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Old 02-25-2010, 08:21 PM   #10
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Two comments, hope you don't mind pointing out things I notice as you go along???

That heater temperature control valve is not a Scout 80 part. That is a simple in-line valve as used on Scout II. Those were commonly used on many different vehicles in the 70's and are readily available in both chromated steel and delrin plastic. There are two different versions, the variations are based upon direction of flow vs. The cable anchor and pivot. I have a Scout II valve mounted on my pickup as I don;t ,like the valves that mount to the intake manifold with a pipe thread or to the thermostat housing. The way I've mounted mine, the nomenclature on the control panel is backwards, hot means cold and cold means hot! Those valves do have a "direction of flow" since they incorporate a bypass system to avoid trapping air and creating a "gurgling" sound when shut off.

The oem valve on a heater-equipped Scout 80 was a simple "stop-cock" household plumbing part, those are terrible regarding seizing and rotting internally, but back then they didn't know any better (or care)!

As for the radiator,...I'm not trying to spam-solicit ya...but they are extremely hard to come by as far as a nice one! So happens I have two of the large size for a Scout 80 at my location, one is freshly done (but not by me), the other is unknown but could be made nice with a few hours work. I don't have an option "fan shroud" for either, it took me three years to find one!

The larger radiator will mount just fine in your rig, but you will need to remove the bolt-on top of the core support and cut it out a bit (neatly) to allow full air flow through the core.

If interested in either radiator, please email me at:

michael@IHPartsAmerica.com

I'll send ya pics of the better of the two units with it under pressure test so ya can see that is good enough to go in my own junk! Then if you want it, contact Jeff at IH Parts America and place an order, I'll drop ship to ya when I get a packing slip from Jeff. We'll price it to ya at that point, it will be very reasonable as compared to the two quotes you currently have!

This pic is a "typical" of the "increased cooling" radiator, notice the relationship of the top tank to the top of the care support as compared to yours.

This radiator was in terrible shape, the top tank had several holes plugged with sheetmetal screws and rubber faucet washers! The bottom tank had been chafing on the lower front fender support where your front center body mount is located (very common damage point). Both nipples were broken out also. Took about 1.5 hours to repair it, 3 hours to comb it! It's indistinguishable from new once repaired and will pressure test at 15psi (twice it's working pressure which is 7psi).
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Old 03-07-2010, 01:50 PM   #11
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Thanks michael,

I sent you a email about the radiator. I got back in from picking up the other Scout early this morning. 1,232 miles in 23 hours and 81 gallons of diesel which is now converted to carbon. (you are welcome al gore) was pretty tired. I got to meet stu simpson and relieved him of the Scout. Now I got a few more parts in case I run across something that is broken.

Let me know thanks.
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Old 03-07-2010, 06:33 PM   #12
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Got your email, I'll pressure test both radiators tomorrow and have some pics for ya. I'm kinda "down" right now with a kidney stone attack! All I can do right now is sit here at the pooter and peck, nothing meaningful!
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Old 03-07-2010, 06:42 PM   #13
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by michael mayben View Post
got your email, I'll pressure test both radiators tomorrow and have some pics for ya. I'm kinda "down" right now with a kidney stone attack! All I can do right now is sit here at the pooter and peck, nothing meaningful!
Those kidney stones are no joke. They will put a man on his knees. A buddy of mine had one, he couldn't even stand up striaght.
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Old 03-07-2010, 07:17 PM   #14
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Got a carb. A little comparsion from the carb off my Scout and the one I got yesterday.

The stamped number in top of the new carb


The economizer



Even has the poppet vavle



Don't know if this is important or not but the stem is a little bent but still looks like it seals off



Correct #62 main jet



No cracks on the inlet boss




I did notice this on top of the fuel bowl. It looks like some sort of vent.


The other carb didn't have it.

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Old 03-08-2010, 03:09 PM   #15
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Default Re: Almost 39 years ago.

Brakes.......


Well after looking around town I was about to give up on the brake lines and go with regular steel lines. But as luck would have it. I walked into a hydraulic supply shop and asked.

Conversation.
Me: do yall have any or a better question would be can you get 3/16 stainless steel tubing?
Guy: how much do you need and what thickness?
Me: I figured 20ft stick and something that I can bend maybe .035 wall.
Guy: hmmmm... Hold on a sec. (walks away and comes back about 2 min)
guy: is this what you are looking for? (has exactly what I asked for)
me: why hell ya that is it.

So now I got that ss tubing for the brakes and the clutch. Will go back for the 1/4 inch that will be ran for the fuel lines.

Also thanks to stu he had 4 brand new wheel cylinders for it. Now I need to get a master cylinder and have some rubber hoses made up.

Aint she pretty




And the wheel cylinders

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